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The mistake they made with that situation was telling Yu what the supposed tip was; of course he was going to go back and check the tape. If he can't see it in slow motion on replay then there was no glove waveing. Also, what a class act Darvish is.

A very interesting response from Yu Darvish:

Cue Rick Hahn... "They said we'd never enter a rebuild, and we did that. They said we'd never make a trade with the Cubs, and we did that. They said we'd never go into the penalty to sign a big international guy, and we did that..."

Shocking that a young player would not want to be relegated to DH. I'm shocked.

No...but Rodon and Sanchez would get it done.

Nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes, and Caulfield posts.

Giolito was broken when the Sox acquired him - he's now, arguably, a top 10 arm in baseball. Kopech couldn't find command; he struggled early with the Sox before finding his release point and really taking off. Dunning had developed really nicely before the injury. The Sox got a 4 MPH increase out of Stievers fastball in ONE off-season. They turned Tommy Kahnle, Anthony Swarzak went from worthless, to a piece they traded at the deadline for something. I won't even get into the find and development of Q and Sale.

After reading Fegan's piece in September about continuity within the system and one voice/message throughout all levels, paired with the massive jump in analytics this year at the MLB level, I find the anger directed at Cooper by fans to be misguided. When you read Eno Sarris talk about how the average pitching coach tenure is 1 season, you realize that continuity is likely a better driving force of success than constant turnover. You will have peaks and valleys within the tenure, but the continuity from level to level has a lot of value. Cooper also isn't as archaic as people think. An excerpt from one of the articles I found promising: But Giolito — who ditched his sinker and returned to working exclusively with a high-riding four-seamer because of a report from White Sox analytics in spring training — says that the simplicity of in-game cues frequently belies the complexity of mid-week work on spin axis, ride, spin rate, angle and extension. Getting López’s fastball to ride like it did over the barrels of Cleveland hitters all afternoon has been a back-and-forth battle with frequent hiccups. But it’s been about establishing in side sessions what elements in his delivery will produce the fastball action they’re looking for with Trackman and Rapsodo data, and getting him to carry that into games. “A lot of credit to Coop and Has (bullpen coach Curt Hasler) with having the old-school background, old-school pitching mentality and learning all this stuff from our analytics department,” Giolito said. “Really, really educating themselves so they can in turn help all the pitchers. We look at that stuff on an almost daily basis in our bullpens and stuff like that and that’s been super beneficial to me this year. When I can look at an outing and see I climbed up a little higher (in release point) and my ride wasn’t as good. OK, let me go into my next bullpen and focus on getting back into my good (arm) slot and then we have the Rapsodo on it and it’s like oh, there it is, there’s the carry and the way the ball should be coming out. A lot of credit to them for learning all that stuff, taking it all on.”

I just drew a Venn diagram with one circle representing us signing Cole and the other circle representing us signing Wheeler. This is what it looks like... O O

Yu has always been very well spoken and intelligent. He gets into his own head sometimes but that's well said. To grind your entire life for that opportunity only to feel cheated at the end of the day must really suck.

Right now the White Sox have 3 starting pitchers. 2 previous starters are expected back from Tommy John surgery at some point in 2020. Both will start in the minors for at least some rehab starts and be called up when they are ready. One has yet to pitch 15 innings at the big league level and the other has only pitched more than 150 innings once in 5 seasons. The White Sox might get one quality starter this offseason but if they have the chance to get two I think they should go for it. If at any point the White Sox have 7 starters that are healthy and playing well enough to be on a contending club then the Sox will likely be going to the postseason. I don't see this as a problem.

Rodon and Sanchez for Betts... I made some similar types of trades back in the day on Ken Griffey Jr's Slugfest. Mike Caruso for half the Cleveland Indians roster. Done deal!

I love Donaldson's response.

Yeah it makes Yelich look like a fucking bag though. Brewers put up a whopping 0.90 ERA against him this year. Also Yu wasn't even accusing him. A little defensive there from the best player on a team that has at least been accused, credibly or not, of sign stealing.

Four players whoever they are spreads the risk. RF is definitely the position I am most at sea about. As you know...every player talked about has some glaring weakness. A one year rental of Pederson would cost a body of some sort...Castellanos looks to have some defensive issues...Calhoun is thought to be lack luster signing...and the guy I mentioned this morning Tsutsoga is anyone's guess. I kind of think RH is liable to pull a name we haven't talked about...after all...that's what he gets paid to do.

“We’re going to need at least a year to evaluate all of you offensive players after you’ve stopped banging on things before we make a trade with you.”

Cmon man. Stop with this spamming nonsense.

or Frank Thomas.

He probably did. Luhnow is a cutthroat scumbag

the hell with this. Wheeler would be like getting a yellow sweater for Christmas.

He can have the illustrious distinction for 1 season!

What are you being critical of? What does any of this have to do with this thread? Yes, if their best starter gets hurt that would be bad. How do you contend in just one half of baseball? How was kopech going to make a 70 win team into an 82 win team? Development isnt linear. Guys you were disappointed in last year could make adjustments and come out strong. You honestly never know. Why is Balta the one that determines the success of the rebuild?

He missed games earlier in the season with a concussion, I believe. They can always use that as a reason.

They said we shouldn’t select Nick Madrigal so high...or Vaughn. They said we could never have the #1 ranked farm system again, etc. Does it really matter when he’s part of the same braintrust trading away Top 3 MVP candidates in Semien and Tatis to other teams, blowing up the payroll simultaneously to the point there was no other realistic choice but to rebuild?

Rudolph should probably get fined for trying to pull another players helmet off. I would assume he was doing that so he could punch him in the head. Why else would you be doing that? The Garrett suspension is appropriate, but I'm not sure legal action is necessary.

Rookie rankings using Nate Silver's new RAPTOR metric, which captures defense much better than any other advanced statistic:

I honestly don't think it makes sense for the Sox to sign two starters to multi-year deals. You could justify a major signing like Wheeler and then someone like Gio Gonzalez on a 1-year. Also, isn't this thread about Grandal?

If I were the Sox and I was going to pursue Cole, I would act exactly this way and tell Stone and Merkin to say exactly what they said. After being let down with Machado, I would not want the same thing to happen. Now, that doesn't mean we ARE pursuing Cole. We very well might not have any interest in him. I just think that this is the perfect way to act if we were going after him.

He makes an Athletic subscription so worth it. I love the support he received yesterday on Twitter after being called out by Phil Rogers regarding his Moncada vote.

That's the point...neither of us know.

It's all fluid. If opportunity presents itself two sign Cole & Wheeler we might need a cheaper option in RF or DH. We will need to see the whole offseason unfold before judging.

Tsutsogo was posted this morning. Power hitter corner outfielder with suspect glove. Interesting to see if FO has interest. Maybe this eras Iguchi.

We keep saying that...but 50% of the available projected options from a year ago signing extensions, staying with their teams through QO (Odorizzi), etc., it takes YET ONE more option off the table. If the same number of contending teams and quasi-contending teams are NOW chasing five pitchers instead of six (with Wheeler as the obviously headliner of the second tier)...why wouldn't their agents be in a better position in terms of leverage? Are half of the teams automatically now magically going to skip over those five pitchers to the third tier if the asks rise by 10-25%? Pretty unlikely...unless you're a mid-market/limited payroll team like the Rays or A's.

Many things will change between now and 2025. I refuse to believe we need to stay in the middle of the pack instead of top third in order to pay future extensions. Some of these young guns will be extended and some will be traded in exchange for future young guns. That's how the Braves and Cardinals do it.

Unless you think the Sox plan to flirt with the luxury tax on 2022-2025, there is zero percent chance the OD payroll is north of $150M. To do what you’re proposing in one offseason is just simply not feasible.

If WS sign Cole the second pitcher could be a Nova type... If we sign Wheeler than the second pitcher needs to be something like Ryu...If we sign Wheeler and Cole then becomes available you now have Lopez or someone else for trade ammo. I'm saying get pitching and don't worry about it. The better pitching you have the more ammo you have.

Yeah I saw this. NYY was doing the same thing. It is a fucking joke this is and was going on. It ruins the damn game. As good as those Astros hitters are it REALLY makes you wonder what those numbers would look like. I've seen Bregman hit like 7 or 8 HRs so far with this garbage and it just started.

I know it is second nature to these guys but remembering all these signs and then changing them up has to be quite a grueling mental exercise

How the Nationals planned for this was...insane. Washington Post: Sign-stealing in the World Series? The Nationals had a plan, just in case. Whole thing is worth a read.

I am very high on Castellanos bat, and somewhat less concerned with his defense than most. My biggest concern with him is signing him forces the Sox to make a long term commitment to being defensively challenged in the outfield corners, which potentially hurts development of the young pitchers. I wouldnt hate taking a flyer on Puig, who actually plays RF, and will be cheap, but it wouldnt excite me. I agree with you on Dickerson, but coming off an injury, numbers usually regress and we potentially end up with Jon Jay 2.0. Calhoun is the player most likely to turn into Alonso or any of about 15 or so other free agent busts on the South Side, where you can see all the reasons on paper where it could work, but some combination of age, diminishing skill set, possible changes to the ball next year, etc. leads to a .213/.288/ .402 line. Ozuna just makes absolutely no sense to me. Trading for Joc gives us a 3 WAR player and leaves us options for next year.

Let’s hope! After all, Jose is the team leader in the clubhouse for a reason. The more players the Sox have who comport themselves the way Jose has all these years, with his work ethic and positive attitude, the better the team’s chances.

Abreu must be rubbing off on him.

Then maybe he should try to learn to play outfield competently.

One of the many reasons why I was rooting for the Nationals in that World Series. And yea Farquhar is a fucking gem. Outstanding job by the Sox bringing him back to the organization.

I’d be very interested to see what a Murphy and Gray package would cost us. Rockies are said to be trying to shed payroll and I’m sure Murphy fits that bill and can be had for fairly cheap. Not sure what kind of value Gray adds with 2 years of control tho.

I would like to state though that despite the many people against rendon because it moves moncada around again...I think getting Rendon would be so clearly a net positive that you go for it. He's so good. I just also get some Adrian Beltre "he'l be good forever" vibes from him.