Spumoni Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 19 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: Baseball doesn't make any sense a lot of the time. Part of the intrigue and frustration. To be fair it allows for part of the fun. Only those that truly pay attention and "get it" can assess value, as opposed to those who look to W-L Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 37 minutes ago, Spumoni said: It's really a way that the game has failed to adapt. I still know "old-timers" that think W-L record actually matters Some of us are sad W/L no longer matters. In fact, good luck to a starting pitcher making the Hall of Fame in the future. It used to be almost entirely how many wins a pitcher recorded. Now with that not mattering, I guess we go by some ridiculous five-inning standard. It used to be special to wonder if a pitcher would win 20 games or in Wilbur Wood's case or Lamarr Hoyt's 30 games. Now? W/L means absolutely nothing and it's another of many reasons baseball is a huge bore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 (edited) As far as the game .... great win. 3-1 in the bad weather. We'll all take it. I like when Tim Anderson contributes as he did tonight with the HR. Got to keep him fiery. He and Abreu are obviously the leaders. Sox have played a bit better, in fact, since Abreu spoke about the state of the team to the media after a recent game. The interviewin which he said everybody cares greatly. Edited May 4, 2022 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 5 hours ago, greg775 said: Some of us are sad W/L no longer matters. In fact, good luck to a starting pitcher making the Hall of Fame in the future. It used to be almost entirely how many wins a pitcher recorded. Now with that not mattering, I guess we go by some ridiculous five-inning standard. It used to be special to wonder if a pitcher would win 20 games or in Wilbur Wood's case or Lamarr Hoyt's 30 games. Now? W/L means absolutely nothing and it's another of many reasons baseball is a huge bore. Meh. I don't think how wins and losses are determined for pitchers is a reason baseball is boring. The pace of the game is, by far, the biggest contributing factor. It's just a dumb rule though. A pitcher can go out and pitch his ass off for 4+ innings and leave with the lead and not get the win. But a guy can come in, finish the 5th by facing a couple batters, and if the team holds on and wins, he gets the win. The starter gets...nothing. There is and will continue to be less of an emphasis on wins for pitchers and more focus on all the other stats that actually tell you how the pitcher is performing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
35thstreetswarm Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 I was surprised that they were uncharacteristically critical of TLR on the postgame show for not allowing Kopech to get the win. (My reaction was — *that’s* what you criticize him for? Something that actually made some sense?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 31 minutes ago, hogan873 said: Meh. I don't think how wins and losses are determined for pitchers is a reason baseball is boring. The pace of the game is, by far, the biggest contributing factor. It's just a dumb rule though. A pitcher can go out and pitch his ass off for 4+ innings and leave with the lead and not get the win. But a guy can come in, finish the 5th by facing a couple batters, and if the team holds on and wins, he gets the win. The starter gets...nothing. There is and will continue to be less of an emphasis on wins for pitchers and more focus on all the other stats that actually tell you how the pitcher is performing. W/L is still a great stat for a long season. All the starter has to do is pitch at least 5 and leave with the lead to have a chance for the W. Kopech didn't pitch well enough to last 5. He knows it and probably accepts it better than you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 46 minutes ago, oldsox said: W/L is still a great stat for a long season. All the starter has to do is pitch at least 5 and leave with the lead to have a chance for the W. Kopech didn't pitch well enough to last 5. He knows it and probably accepts it better than you do. Kopech certainly seemed like he accepted it, based on his comments post-game. And I accept it...not sure why my acceptance matters though. My point was that nowadays we're seeing more starting pitchers not making it deep enough to win games that they had a big hand in winning. Starting pitchers don't go as deep into games as they had in the past. Partly due to caution for health, partly due to the additional wear and tear on pitchers now (increased types of pitches leads to increased stress on the arm), and partly due to shifting strategies. In 1965, the average outing for starting pitchers was 6.28 innings. In 2019, it was 5.26 innings. I understand the logic behind the rule. And I can see why it's viewed as important to get through 5 innings. But getting a win should not be one of the most important reasons for handling of the pitching staff. If wins are going to be one of the most important stats, then maybe how the win is determined should be changed. Back on subject though - Nice win and fuck the Cubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zisk Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 Bullpen looked good last night. Another perfect night for baseball. Don't think I've seen such a long string of shit weather to start a season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CentralChamps21 Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 26 minutes ago, zisk said: Bullpen looked good last night. Another perfect night for baseball. Don't think I've seen such a long string of shit weather to start a season. No, but that's why no team should be scheduled to play their first 40+ games all in places where it might be cold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grinder Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 56 minutes ago, CentralChamps21 said: No, but that's why no team should be scheduled to play their first 40+ games all in places where it might be cold. That would make too much sense! But theres probably a reason behind that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Sox Park Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 That weather last night reminded me of Scotland . most times that i was there, it was like that . great to see a winning streak started . looking forward to Moncada's return. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kids Can Play Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 Great win considering the horrific weather conditions. It's always so satisfying to beat the Cubs! Other than Ruiz, the bullpen once again looked really good. If Ruiz would have done his job, the Sox could have had their 3rd shutout in their last four games. The Offense is still struggling and the bats need to come alive. However it might help if the three veterans Grandal (.162), Pollack (.184), and Abreu (.215) who make $18,250 mil, $14,500 mil and $19,666 mil, start earning their money! Especially since those three salaries represent 27% of the team payroll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colome's Hat Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 1 hour ago, The Kids Can Play said: Great win considering the horrific weather conditions. It's always so satisfying to beat the Cubs! Other than Ruiz, the bullpen once again looked really good. If Ruiz would have done his job, the Sox could have had their 3rd shutout in their last four games. The Offense is still struggling and the bats need to come alive. However it might help if the three veterans Grandal (.162), Pollack (.184), and Abreu (.215) who make $18,250 mil, $14,500 mil and $19,666 mil, start earning their money! Especially since those three salaries represent 27% of the team payroll. Yes but on a July day, several of their outs would have been home runs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 3 hours ago, hogan873 said: But getting a win should not be one of the most important reasons for handling of the pitching staff. They are, people only give a shit about the win that goes in the standings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 (edited) Al Yellon cracks me up. Classic homer and old man b**** fest about the game, weather and crowd last night on his writeup: https://www.bleedcubbieblue.com/2022/5/4/23056606/cubs-white-sox-recap-keegan-thompson-nico-hoerner-mlb-scores The funniest part is how numerous people that were at the game telling him most the fights were started by cubs fans and Al saying "didn't see any of that around me!". There are idiots everywhere and I'm sure Sox fans did their share of fighting but to completely deny that fights even broke out is on another level. I guess reading it again you could charitably assume Al just meant he didn't see any fights around him and wasn't denying (the caught on video) numerous cubs fans involved in scuffles. Edited May 4, 2022 by chitownsportsfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopek Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 3 hours ago, CentralChamps21 said: No, but that's why no team should be scheduled to play their first 40+ games all in places where it might be cold. I'm not gonna pretend to know all the moving parts involved with scheduling, but how does a team like Houston opening the season with 9 road games make any sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Mite Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 Like some have said, pitchers W-L aren't that relevant anymore but if they are going to reward a W to someone it's time to change the rule to maybe giving it to the pitcher who threw the most innings like Kopech last night. The pitcher of course would have to be the pitcher of record when he was relieved otherwise everything else would remain the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 2 hours ago, White Sox Park said: That weather last night reminded me of Scotland . most times that i was there, it was like that . great to see a winning streak started . looking forward to Moncada's return. Yea, it reminded me of being on the beach out at Neah Bay in WA. It's miserable. It's not just the 48 degrees it's the constant blowing drizzle that just never lets up. You do not want to be in that weather without a warm fire and a dry tent. I don't recommend going and sitting outside at a baseball game in it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 (edited) The W/L controversy surrounding last night is dumb. I love the W/L stat but it's gonzo forever. The stat lovers who took over the game deemed it meaningless and pitchers aren't expected to even go more than six innings max anymore, so it's meaningless and should not even be a subject of discussion ever again. Thank goodness in 05 pitchers were allowed to throw complete games. Edited May 4, 2022 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 7 minutes ago, Snopek said: I'm not gonna pretend to know all the moving parts involved with scheduling, but how does a team like Houston opening the season with 9 road games make any sense? The southern owners don't want lopsided home schedules before summer. They will lose a lot of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 1 minute ago, greg775 said: The W/L controversy surrounding last night is dumb. I love the W/L stat but it's gonzo forever. The stat lovers who took over the game deemed it meaningless and pitchers aren't expected to even go more than six innings max anymore, so it's meaningless and should not even be a subject of discussion ever again. Reset your troll meter to zero, you had a good run, I think it was like 100 posts in a row. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 4, 2022 Author Share Posted May 4, 2022 2 minutes ago, greg775 said: The W/L controversy surrounding last night is dumb. I love the W/L stat but it's gonzo forever. The stat lovers who took over the game deemed it meaningless and pitchers aren't expected to even go more than six innings max anymore, so it's meaningless and should not even be a subject of discussion ever again. Thank goodness in 05 pitchers were allowed to throw complete games. Why would a non-stat lover be upset about a stat being deemed meaningless? Oh right. I see who posted this now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: Reset your troll meter to zero, you had a good run, I think it was like 100 posts in a row. All I did that was different in that post was not put IMO and not be polite. Why? this issue of W/L and pitchers not going more than six innings thoroughly ANGERS me. Sorry if my anger shows thru in a limited number of my posts when I get furious about an issue. The abandonment of W/L will have an effect on Hall of Fame status of pitchers in the future. It used to be a staple of how a starter got in. Nobody responds to me about that yet. Sorry I won't forget to put IMO on ALL my posts from now on. Otherwise I'm a troll. Edited May 4, 2022 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 Just now, greg775 said: All I did that was different in that post was not put IMO. Why? this issue of W/L and pitchers not going more than six innings thoroughly ANGERS me. Sorry if my anger shows thru in a limited number of my posts when I get furious about an issue. The abandonment of W/L will have an effect on Hall of Fame status of pitchers in the future. It used to be a staple of how a starter got in. Nobody responds to me about that yet. Sorry I won't forget to put IMO on ALL my posts from now on. Otherwise I'm a troll. Why does 6 innings matter if your team wins the game. Who cares Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spumoni Posted May 4, 2022 Share Posted May 4, 2022 4 minutes ago, greg775 said: All I did that was different in that post was not put IMO and not be polite. Why? this issue of W/L and pitchers not going more than six innings thoroughly ANGERS me. Sorry if my anger shows thru in a limited number of my posts when I get furious about an issue. The abandonment of W/L will have an effect on Hall of Fame status of pitchers in the future. It used to be a staple of how a starter got in. Nobody responds to me about that yet. Sorry I won't forget to put IMO on ALL my posts from now on. Otherwise I'm a troll. Couldn't the voters just... look at their other statistics and body of work? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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