Trade Rumors Catch-all

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

29 minutes ago, The Kids Can Play said:

Happ is not some superstar you seem to project him as and that he will be the reason to save our season. That is actually comical if you believe that. He most definitely isn't worth giving up Crochet for others in addition to Crochet. Additionally, your analysis of Crochet is so wrong. He is not technically a reliever. He was only used as a reliever in his rookie season due to not being able to go through the minors because of Covid. In time he can definitely be solid starter for us. Again until we find out how he can bounce back from Tommy John surgery, it would be foolish to give Crochet up, since starters are the most valuable pieces to a championship team. Plus even if he isn't a starter for two years, he will not be wasted in the bullpen.

If Crochet after TJ surgery can eventually get back to his upper 90's fastball and especially since he has a above average nasty slider, is why trading him away is just ridiculous. 

Ok first off Happ isn't a superstar but he is head and shoulders above what the Sox have in the OF.

Secondly Crochet is an injured reliever period. He has no body of work as a starting pitcher even when he was in college. His arm will take 2 if not 3 years to become a full time starter in MLB  and that's if he isn't injured again trying to handle the workoad of a starter. As of right now he says he wants to start but there are very very few who view him as as potential high quality starting pitcher.

Ask @ptatc or any other experts on how to view Crochet's road to becoming a quality starting pitcher.

 

Edited July 25, 2022 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[CentralChamps21]

2 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

HA I'm not against getting both but Reynolds plus Martin Perez from the Rangers I'd like more since there still might be a potential matchup against the Astros and they are just so good now and Perez has snuffed them cold in both his starts against them this year.

But you'd probably have to trade Eloy or Vaughn to empty out the OF a bit if you got Happ and Reynolds. Sheets also traded or sent back to the minors.

I have no issue with trading Eloy and Sheets.

Edited to add: Pirates probably not interested in Eloy because of his salary so maybe get a 3rd team involved?

Edited July 25, 2022 by CentralChamps21

[Chicago White Sox]

1 hour ago, Lillian said:

Would Colas, Jose Rodriguez, Thompson and Dalquist be enough for the Pirates to part with Reynolds? I personally doubt it. 

Montgomery, Colas, plus something else good if I had to guess

[The Kids Can Play]

2 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Ok first off Happ isn't a superstar but he is head and shoulders above what the Sox have in the OF.

Secondly Crochet is an injured reliever period. He has no body of work as a starting pitcher even when he was in college. His arm will take 2 if not 3 years to become a full time starter in MLB  and that's if he isn't injured again trying to handle the workoad of a starter. As of right now he says he wants to start but there are very very few who view him as as potential high quality starting pitcher.

Ask @ptatc or any other experts on how to view Crochet's road to becoming a quality starting pitcher.

 

Oh so Happ is now head and shoulders better than Vaughn and Robert when they play the outfield. Again you are missing the big picture, we already have one of the lowest ranked farm systems and to give away potential future stars for just an average player like Happ is plain dumb. Plus Happ has been inconsistent, yes he is having a decent year., but how do you know he won't go back to previous years like '20 and '21. In 2020 the pandemic season he hit 12 HR's and .258 in what was strictly the NL and AL central divisions. They were the two worst divisions in baseball that year. Last year he hit 25 HR's and a .226 BA in Wrigley field, The majority of their games were against the weak NL central teams. 

Adding Happ will not produce a playoff winning team. Yes, right field has been a problem this year, but not anywhere close to the problem with the constant poor starting pitching from Kopech, Giolito and Lynn, followed by a horrible bullpen and which was very inconsistent until recently, along with way too many underperforming players like Moncada, Eloy, Grandal, AJ Pollack, Garcia, Harrison, Sheets and Engel. 

Crochet was doing a good job until he tore his tendon in his arm and thus needed TJ surgery. It was suggested he probably was playing hurt for quite awhile and why he lost the speed on his fastball. That's why people go get TJ surgery so they can get a new surgically repaired arm which has worked out great for many pitchers. 

I don't need to go ask anyone else or other so called experts on Crochet's road to recovery. I have seen what other pitchers have done after tommy john surgery including Justin Verlander this year and in the past Shohei Ohtani, deGrom, Strasburg, Smoltz, Darvish and many others and Kopech until he hurt his knee. Oh btw, we will be needing pitchers a few years from now. I don't care if it takes a little time and that's why I'm confused why you would give away a 23 yr old former #1 pick with a lot of upside for an average at best player.

[bmags]

1 hour ago, The Kids Can Play said:

Oh so Happ is now head and shoulders better than Vaughn and Robert when they play the outfield. Again you are missing the big picture, we already have one of the lowest ranked farm systems and to give away potential future stars for just an average player like Happ is plain dumb. Plus Happ has been inconsistent, yes he is having a decent year., but how do you know he won't go back to previous years like '20 and '21. In 2020 the pandemic season he hit 12 HR's and .258 in what was strictly the NL and AL central divisions. They were the two worst divisions in baseball that year. Last year he hit 25 HR's and a .226 BA in Wrigley field, The majority of their games were against the weak NL central teams. 

Adding Happ will not produce a playoff winning team. Yes, right field has been a problem this year, but not anywhere close to the problem with the constant poor starting pitching from Kopech, Giolito and Lynn, followed by a horrible bullpen and which was very inconsistent until recently, along with way too many underperforming players like Moncada, Eloy, Grandal, AJ Pollack, Garcia, Harrison, Sheets and Engel. 

Crochet was doing a good job until he tore his tendon in his arm and thus needed TJ surgery. It was suggested he probably was playing hurt for quite awhile and why he lost the speed on his fastball. That's why people go get TJ surgery so they can get a new surgically repaired arm which has worked out great for many pitchers. 

I don't need to go ask anyone else or other so called experts on Crochet's road to recovery. I have seen what other pitchers have done after tommy john surgery including Justin Verlander this year and in the past Shohei Ohtani, deGrom, Strasburg, Smoltz, Darvish and many others and Kopech until he hurt his knee. Oh btw, we will be needing pitchers a few years from now. I don't care if it takes a little time and that's why I'm confused why you would give away a 23 yr old former #1 pick with a lot of upside for an average at best player.

i unno man.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Ok brother you're right. Even though I never said anything about Robert but go ahead put words in my mouth.Guess we will just have to see how successful Crochet is as a starting pitcher in 3 years. If you don't think a certified physical therapist who used to work in MLB can't teach u anything about what lies ahead for Crochet we'll just chalk that up to you thinking you have all the answers.

As i said it has less to do with the Tommy John surgery and more to do with the lack of previous starting experience on his arm already but I guess you just ignored that part.

Yes, I also agree the Sox need another starting pitcher . But if you don't think the total lack of good fielding + good LHH OF isn't a big problem too,  nothing I can say will change your mind. Vaughn is a 1st Baseman, Sheets is a 1st baseman, Engel doesn't have the bat and he's RH, Pollock is RH and he hasn't hit RHP at all. Eloy can't even play the field. Even if you could combine the 1 LHH OF we have with Sheets bat and the best fielding OF we have in Engel it still wouldn't be a player as good as Happ and that's the problem . The Sox have a bunch of half outfielders who either can't hit or can't field or are injury prone. Happ plays every day he can play the OF well and he's a switch hitter who can hit LHP and RHP.

It would be really nice to get one guy even if he isn't a superstar who can hit both righties and lefties who can also field and play every day. Instead of 5 OF's, none who can stay on the field, hit and play defense. It's really not asking for much to have just 1 guy (besides Robert) who can do anything, everywhere all at once. Oh and btw Robert is missing in action yet again and if it's serious it makes the situation even worse in the OF !

 

Edited July 25, 2022 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, The Kids Can Play said:

Oh so Happ is now head and shoulders better than Vaughn and Robert when they play the outfield. Again you are missing the big picture, we already have one of the lowest ranked farm systems and to give away potential future stars for just an average player like Happ is plain dumb. Plus Happ has been inconsistent, yes he is having a decent year., but how do you know he won't go back to previous years like '20 and '21. In 2020 the pandemic season he hit 12 HR's and .258 in what was strictly the NL and AL central divisions. They were the two worst divisions in baseball that year. Last year he hit 25 HR's and a .226 BA in Wrigley field, The majority of their games were against the weak NL central teams. 

Adding Happ will not produce a playoff winning team. Yes, right field has been a problem this year, but not anywhere close to the problem with the constant poor starting pitching from Kopech, Giolito and Lynn, followed by a horrible bullpen and which was very inconsistent until recently, along with way too many underperforming players like Moncada, Eloy, Grandal, AJ Pollack, Garcia, Harrison, Sheets and Engel. 

Crochet was doing a good job until he tore his tendon in his arm and thus needed TJ surgery. It was suggested he probably was playing hurt for quite awhile and why he lost the speed on his fastball. That's why people go get TJ surgery so they can get a new surgically repaired arm which has worked out great for many pitchers. 

I don't need to go ask anyone else or other so called experts on Crochet's road to recovery. I have seen what other pitchers have done after tommy john surgery including Justin Verlander this year and in the past Shohei Ohtani, deGrom, Strasburg, Smoltz, Darvish and many others and Kopech until he hurt his knee. Oh btw, we will be needing pitchers a few years from now. I don't care if it takes a little time and that's why I'm confused why you would give away a 23 yr old former #1 pick with a lot of upside for an average at best player.

You do know the difference between Garrett Crochet and every single other starting pitcher you listed right?  Since his college career started in 2018, he has NEVER pitched more than 65 innings in a single calendar year.  Never.  You don't get from 60 to 200 innings in a one or two year span either.  You have to be conditioned for it.  Unless he is wiling to spend the next two full seasons in the minors, he will never be a starter.  It's similar to asking Usain Bolt to from the 100 meters to the marathon.  Their bodies just aren't ready for it.

[poppysox]

3 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Montgomery, Colas, plus something else good if I had to guess

Cheaper to get rid of Tony.

[ChiSox59]

5 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Montgomery, Colas, plus something else good if I had to guess

Passssss

[oldsox]

8 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Passssss

Ditto.  Hahn scares me whenever he gets in his trading booth.

[wegner]

35 minutes ago, oldsox said:

Ditto.  Hahn scares me whenever he gets in his trading booth.

Me too

[maxjusttyped]

With Zunino out for the season, I could see the Rays being interested in one of Seby or McGuire. The Rays prioritize framing above all else at the catching position, and they both are above-average framers.

[bmags]

I feel like the way Hahn trades is he knows what players he is willing to trade and works backward from there.

My guess is Crochet is who Hahn wants to use, not Montgomery. So, what teams want a ticking LHR? Texas maybe. Boston. Tampa? 

[bmags]

Just now, maxjusttyped said:

With Zunino out for the season, I could see the Rays being interested in one of Seby or McGuire. The Rays prioritize framing above all else at the catching position, and they both are above-average framers.

With Murphy so cheap I think he’d be 1A.

Plus rays know these guys will DFA one. And Tampa has some equally good players internally.

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

31 minutes ago, maxjusttyped said:

With Zunino out for the season, I could see the Rays being interested in one of Seby or McGuire. The Rays prioritize framing above all else at the catching position, and they both are above-average framers.

Why trade for either of those guys when they could net Murphy or Contreras?

[maxjusttyped]

3 hours ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:

Why trade for either of those guys when they could net Murphy or Contreras?

Maybe someone will correct me, but I can't ever remember the Rays using premium resources  on a catcher.

Both Seby & Reese fit the profile of catcher the Rays typically target was my point.

[BigHurt3515]

11 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Montgomery, Colas, plus something else good if I had to guess

Jesus, Reynolds is not worth what will be two top 100 prospects

[hankchifan]

On 7/24/2022 at 6:00 PM, Chicago White Sox said:

What do you think a hypothetical Happ trade would look like?

Wishful thinking of the day:  would the Cubs take Leury, Engel, and Sheets for Happ, and we will throw in TLR for free?

[hankchifan]

7 hours ago, oldsox said:

Ditto.  Hahn scares me whenever he gets in his trading booth.

Yes, we will probably end with two relievers and no lefty outfielder.

[Chimpton]

2 hours ago, hankchifan said:

Wishful thinking of the day:  would the Cubs take Leury, Engel, and Sheets for Happ, and we will throw in TLR for free?

You just blew the trade with that last bit! 

[GradMc]

I'd rather see the Sox bring up some of their minor league talent than trade it.

Everyone is stuck on winning the division.

The goal is getting to and winning  the world series.

That ain't happening this year with this "all-out" owner, his incompetent  front office and well past his prime manager.

The same issues that plague the Sox for the past several years still haven't been addressed (2B, RF , eli SP).

The Sox need elite talent which comes from signing top tier free agents. Trading away what little talent they have in the minors is an horrendous decision.

 

 

Edited July 26, 2022 by GradMc

[South Side Hit Men]

Have to laugh looking at the negative trade values on the current Sox team. Of the five players with a value over negative $1M (all over $5M), three of the five were Hahn's acquisitions this offseason. Consistent with driving a new car off the lot and immediately losing significant value.

https://www.baseballtradevalues.com/teams/467/

• Pollock ($7M)
• Grandal ($6.7M)
• Kelly ($6.1M)
• Leury Garcia ($5.8M)
• Bummer ($5.1M)

[KipWellsFan]

12 hours ago, maxjusttyped said:

With Zunino out for the season, I could see the Rays being interested in one of Seby or McGuire. The Rays prioritize framing above all else at the catching position, and they both are above-average framers.

According to Baseball Savant, Reese McGuire is NOT an above average framer this season. And last year he was only slightly above average.

[NCsoxfan]

If we are not good enough to win the World Series and barely good enough to win the division, why in the heck would we trade our only few worthwhile prospects?

[maxjusttyped]

1 hour ago, KipWellsFan said:

According to Baseball Savant, Reese McGuire is NOT an above average framer this season. And last year he was only slightly above average.

Savant had him as the 11th most valuable framer last season despite catching ~half the number of pitches as some of the catchers around him. This year both Fangraphs and Savant both have him at +1 runs or better. He's very clearly a good pitch framer and defensive catcher overall.

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/catcher_framing?year=2022&team=&min=q&type=catcher&sort=4,1
https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=c&stats=fld&lg=all&qual=40&type=1&season=2022&month=0&season1=2022&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2022-01-01&enddate=2022-12-31&sort=20,d

Edited July 26, 2022 by maxjusttyped