TA to bench. Remilliard in and batting 2 nd. No brainer.

[Quin]

2 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Burger is down to a 113 wRC+ and over the last 30 days is hitting 182 and rocking a 234 OBP and a 600 OPS. Frankly, it looks like he was a flash in the pan and has been figured out. Nice story, but a hot 4 weeks doesn't make a season or career. On this sad sad team he stood out for a minute but now he's hitting like a poor man's rob deere.

To be fair, you don't want a well done Burger.

[Slayer12]

Agree that he should be moved down in the lineup. I personally would put him 9th, so hopefully when he does hit, we are rolling the lineup over with speed. 

But taking him out of the lineup is not the answer. He needs the reps to get this figured out. The man was a batting champ, it's going to come around at some point. 

I'm pissed off at his play to, but killing his confidence by benching him is only going to have an adverse affect on this organization. We'd end up trading him and he'll end up being an All-Star somewhere else.

 

Now that I think about it, this is the White Sox, you can almost bet your wife on that last sentence happening.

[FloydBannister1983]

4 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

He will be traded in less than 40 days one way or another.

It’s a shame that everyone is probably going to  focus on the last two bad months here rather than the 3-4 good years he had here. 

He was still a narcissist jerk while he was playing better. 

[SonofaRoache]

You can't bench TA for good, but move him down and give him a few off days. TA needs to hit .300 to be a valuable piece for us with his limited power these days and shoddy defense. 

[hankchifan]

3 hours ago, Capn12 said:

Hey look....TA in the 2 hole again today, who would have thought? BTW, TA is showing to be a ROARING success in the 2 hole...

 

TA  batting second is one of the reasons for Robert’s

 

On 6/27/2023 at 11:14 PM, Harry Chappas said:

There isn't one this is the White Sox. 

 many solo homers. 

[Lip Man 1]

DVS of the Sun-Times with a story on Anderson this afternoon. The numbers are, to say the least, ugly:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2023/6/29/23778671/white-sox-tim-anderson-working-his-tail-off-to-break-awful-slump

[hankchifan]

5 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

DVS of the Sun-Times with a story on Anderson this afternoon. The numbers are, to say the least, ugly:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2023/6/29/23778671/white-sox-tim-anderson-working-his-tail-off-to-break-awful-slump

It is great that TA is practicing hard, but let’s take him out of the second spot.  He can execute thee results of his work from the bottom of the line up.  You cannot afford to be hitting second with a less than .100 avg ahead of Robert.

 

 

[tray]

As we know, MLB hitting is a perpetual cat and mouse game with hitters vs. pitching scouts. TA and whoever is advising him on the Sox coaching staff have been on the short end of that game this season. As a fan it seems like a lot of TA's success in the past few seasons was his ability to look for outside pitches and drive them to right center or right field (as he famously did in the FOD game).  Now he seems to be off balance from the first pitch - perhaps looking for pitches he is not getting... then when he gets down two strikes he looks like an easy out, not a former batting champion. Just my 2 cents, but maybe he needs to be more patient, or start looking for pitches in locations that he has been whiffing on or grounding out. And no, you don't give up on a former star player even if you don't like him personally or for some, perhaps even hate the guy for whatever reason.  A lot of things have to go right for the Sox to get back into the race for the Division, and he is one part of that.

[CentralChamps21]

TA finally out of the leadoff spot, but how much longer does he stay in the #2 slot?

He has a worse wRC+ than everybody except Zavala.

You could argue both Elvis and Remillard should play over him, but at least he should be batting 8th-9th when he does play.

He's provided essentially no value to this team this year. Maybe demoting him will wake up some other guys.

[chitownsportsfan]

3 hours ago, hankchifan said:

TA  batting second is one of the reasons for Robert’s

 

 many solo homers. 

He took Jose's mild indignation at occasionally having to hit with a runner in motion way too seriously...

[South Side Hit Men]

2 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

DVS of the Sun-Times with a story on Anderson this afternoon. The numbers are, to say the least, ugly:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2023/6/29/23778671/white-sox-tim-anderson-working-his-tail-off-to-break-awful-slump

Quote

The Sox are 174-132 when Anderson starts and 71-89 when he doesn’t since the beginning of the 2020 season. 

This is still the highest TWTW score (+60) on the current roster among hitters, and even higher when you stretch it over his entire career.

What would have been informative in that article is what exactly is Tim working on? What is he "buying into" per Johnson's words? 

Making contact, hitting with more power, going the other way, pitch recognition, all of the above?

Also, is he still dealing with lingering pain or limitations after his 2022 wrist injury and his 2023 Hanser Alberto induced left knee injury?

Tim had an OK start to the season before this second injury (.298 BA, .323 OBP, .404 SLG, .731 OPS). Still thinking the wrist injury is impacting his power, and not sure his knee is also still screwed up denying him strength in his legs.

Edited June 30, 2023 by South Side Hit Men

[Lip Man 1]

1 minute ago, South Side Hit Men said:

This is still the highest TWTW score (+60) on the current roster among hitters, and even higher when you stretch it over his entire career.

What would have been informative in that article is what exactly is Tim working on? What is he "buying into" per Johnson's words? 

Making contact, hitting with more power, going the other way, pitch recognition, all of the above?

Also, is he still dealing with lingering pain or limitations after his 2022 wrist injury and his 2023 Hanser Alberto induced injury? Tim had an OK start before this second injury (.298 BA, .323 OBP, .404 SLG, .731 OPS). Still thinking the wrist injury is impacting his power, and not sure his knee is also still screwed up denying him strength in his legs.

Maybe but remember he hurt the finger ligament in what early September? I don't think he's had a home run since last June.

If that's the case then he wasn't hitting for power for at least a month (probably longer) before the finger injury. 

I continue to think his off the field antics are contributing as much if not more to his dramatic drop in productivity. 

 

[South Side Hit Men]

20 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Maybe but remember he hurt the finger ligament in what early September? I don't think he's had a home run since last June.

If that's the case then he wasn't hitting for power for at least a month (probably longer) before the finger injury. 

I don't recall the specifics of each injury last year, but he hit .896 through May before being down for a month, and wasn't the same the several weeks he returned before being shut down for the season. Was it the wrist injury in May and then finger in early Aug (it wasn't September unless he was hurt rehabbing).

In my mind, he was likely rushed back like Robert, Grandal and others in desperation due to Hahn's perpetual lack of quality depth. Hand, wrist and finger injuries take a long time to recover from in terms of regaining full power. Benintendi will likely not be at full strength until late this year or next season.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/gl.fcgi?id=anderti01&t=b&year=2022

[Lip Man 1]

2 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

I don't recall the specifics of each injury last year, but he hit .896 through May before being down for a month, and wasn't the same the several weeks he returned before being shut down for the season. Was it the wrist injury in May and then finger in early Aug (it wasn't September unless he was hurt rehabbing).

In my mind, he was likely rushed back like Robert, Grandal and others in desperation due to Hahn's perpetual lack of quality depth. Hand, wrist and finger injuries take a long time to recover from in terms of regaining full power. Benintendi will likely not be at full strength until late this year or next season.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/gl.fcgi?id=anderti01&t=b&year=2022

He had the ligament injury at Texas. Sox were there from  August 4-7. His last home run came in June, so it was at least a month since he hit his last dinger (probably longer) before the injury. That tells me something was going off the rails even before the ligament tear. 

He never played the final two months of the season. 

Edited June 30, 2023 by Lip Man 1

[hankchifan]

4 hours ago, CentralChamps21 said:

TA finally out of the leadoff spot, but how much longer does he stay in the #2 slot?

He has a worse wRC+ than everybody except Zavala.

You could argue both Elvis and Remillard should play over him, but at least he should be batting 8th-9th when he does play.

He's provided essentially no value to this team this year. Maybe demoting him will wake up some other guys.

I changed my mind about benching TA as long as he is hitting in the 7 th to 9 th spot.  Never again leading off or batting second until he gets back to past hitting success.

[chitownsportsfan]

5 hours ago, tray said:

As we know, MLB hitting is a perpetual cat and mouse game with hitters vs. pitching scouts. TA and whoever is advising him on the Sox coaching staff have been on the short end of that game this season. As a fan it seems like a lot of TA's success in the past few seasons was his ability to look for outside pitches and drive them to right center or right field (as he famously did in the FOD game).  Now he seems to be off balance from the first pitch - perhaps looking for pitches he is not getting... then when he gets down two strikes he looks like an easy out, not a former batting champion. Just my 2 cents, but maybe he needs to be more patient, or start looking for pitches in locations that he has been whiffing on or grounding out. And no, you don't give up on a former star player even if you don't like him personally or for some, perhaps even hate the guy for whatever reason.  A lot of things have to go right for the Sox to get back into the race for the Division, and he is one part of that.

I kinda want to do an old school deep dive into this now based on the publicly available batted ball data. Try and do it tmr at work to kill some time on a Friday. It certainly feels like pitchers have attacked him with fastballs on his hands to get ahead and buried him with junk away and fastballs up in late counts.

I'd also like to look at his stat cast data for speed. Tim is a guy that relies on BABIP and quick hips. When your body ages hips are gonna slow and speed as well, hurting BABIP.

Good post good thoughts.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

20 hours ago, Bob Sacamano said:

I feel like you gotta IL Tim and give him a chance to get healthy (if that has been a factor in him underperforming).

Roster moves:

-TA to 10-day IL

-DFA Clint Frazier (clear a 40-man spot for next move)

-Select the contract of Erik Gonzalez for backup IF (if Sosa is still out) or Nate Moundou (a left-handed hitter) for lineup balance

-Recall Colas

 

Sure sit him out a month or w/e it takes. But his head is really far up his ass. It's like he's brain dead  and can't figure out that just hustling makes up for  having other problems.

He hit an infield pop up a few days ago with someone on 1st and barely made an effort to run. The Angels could've let it drop and turned a DP . If they had done that all hell would've broken loose here but it barely registered as a blip on how screwed up he is.

[ChiSox59]

Can mods at least fix the thread to spell the dude's name right?

Remy deserves to play everyday right now.  Stick him at 2B until that batting average falls below .280. s%*#, give Burger a day off.  He's been awful for awhile now.  

[Bob Sacamano]

9 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Can mods at least fix the thread to spell the dude's name right?

Remy deserves to play everyday right now.  Stick him at 2B until that batting average falls below .280. s%*#, give Burger a day off.  He's been awful for awhile now.  

Yeah, even if you don't bench TA (or IL him), he should still be playing over Elvis. Guy is toast.

[superchops70]

TA's two "singles" yesterday probably earned him another couple weeks in the 2 hole, even though both of those hits were week contact, seeing eye slop shots 

Edited June 30, 2023 by superchops70

[The Kids Can Play]

14 hours ago, hankchifan said:

It is great that TA is practicing hard, but let’s take him out of the second spot.  He can execute thee results of his work from the bottom of the line up.  You cannot afford to be hitting second with a less than .100 avg ahead of Robert.

 

 

You are 100 percent correct. I stated this earlier, TA at 9th is actually the best spot. If TA gets on base, now you have speed on first with Benintendi coming up next. Hopefully a Remi batting 2nd and then Robert at #3 with perhaps a few men on base. 

We just need the rookie manager to put his big boy pants on and have the guts to make that move.