24-25 NFL Thread

[Chisoxfn]

16 minutes ago, chw42 said:

I saw there were some takes that the Bears could take Hampton at 10 if Jeanty went before. I almost wished they did that instead of drafting Loveland.

That would have been worse. 

[Tony]

16 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I keep seeing this cited, but LaPorta is just another example as to why you shouldn't invest tier 1 picks on TE's. Sam was the 34th pick in the draft.

Paying a premium for a TE when you're already paying a tight end is wild

I also think overall it was a poor use of draft capital

[caulfield12]

Omarion Hampton goes 22....really moved up the last six months on draft boards, UNC obviously had a challenging season, but that didn't hurt him at all.

Fits perfectly with the ground it out/ground and pound style of power fb favored by Harbaugh.

[Chisoxfn]

Packers with a wideout - add some speed. Hoping one of the 3 Lt prospects are there at 39. Would love Simmons and would be fine moving up if needed for one of them. 

[chw42]

7 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

Packers with a wideout - add some speed. Hoping one of the 3 Lt prospects are there at 39. Would love Simmons and would be fine moving up if needed for one of them. 

Connerly at 39 would make me feel much better about this draft.

[caulfield12]

Really like Golden if you're a Packers fan, which obviously most here are decidedly not.

Kind of less exciting having no Iowa picks, last year at least it was Cooper DeJean and T.Taylor.

Kaleb Johnson will be the first Hawkeye picked this year, likely late 2nd or early 3rd round.

[caulfield12]

"Dart of the Deal"

lol at that NYpost headline

Poor Sanders family...not feeling too bad for them, maybe he'll be better off it he goes to a team where he can learn for a year or two in a system that fits his talent set.

[SoCalChiSox]

I'm seething in white hot rage.

f*** you Payton and Paton

[chw42]

So the only tackle prospect worth taking tomorrow is probably Ersery. Lots of options at EDGE and DI at 39 and 41 though.

[fathom]

19 minutes ago, chw42 said:

So the only tackle prospect worth taking tomorrow is probably Ersery. Lots of options at EDGE and DI at 39 and 41 though.

Henderson for RB sounds like a strong possibility 

[Chisoxfn]

28 minutes ago, fathom said:

Henderson for RB sounds like a strong possibility 

Seems like ot isn’t happening so dline and rb seems likely. Maybe they trade down once. 

[caulfield12]

Caleb Williams: If Williams doesn't have a big season, there should be alarms going off in Chicago.

The Bears keep setting up Williams to succeed. They didn't get it all done last season, not putting enough resources into the offensive line and making a poor decision to stick with head coach Matt Eberflus one year too long. But this offseason the Bears built up the offensive line in free agency and trades. They hired Ben Johnson, a coveted offensive guru who had a great run as the Detroit Lions' offensive coordinator. And to make it even better, they grabbed tight end Colston Loveland with the 10th pick of the draft.

The Bears passed on Penn State tight end Tyler Warren and other good prospects at receiver and running back — not to mention plenty of help for the defense or offensive line — which is an indication of how excited they are about the versatile Loveland in the offense.

It's hard to say any second-year quarterback is facing a make-or-break season. But Williams, last year's No. 1 overall draft pick, doesn't have any excuses this year.

yahoo.com/sports

[WhiteSox2023]

3 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I keep seeing this cited, but LaPorta is just another example as to why you shouldn't invest tier 1 picks on TE's. Sam was the 34th pick in the draft.

Paying a premium for a TE when you're already paying a tight end is wild

Agreed, I am not a fan of this pick.  If there was a chance to trade down, Poles should have taken it, and if Warren ends up being the better TE, Poles needs to go.

[WhiteSox2023]

6 hours ago, Tony said:

 

Yeah, this is also why the pick is even riskier/scarier.  If you take a TE at #10, you should be getting the sure-fire consensus top TE of the draft.  Between Loveland and Warren, we don’t even know if that’s the case.  For reference, Brock Bowers was drafted at #13 last year and there was no doubt he was the stud TE of the draft.

Meanwhile, mentioning Sam LaPorta actually makes this pick look worse because he wasn’t taken until #34 in the 2nd round of the 2023 draft.

I would be very surprised if Poles couldn’t have traded down, got an extra pick, and still drafted Loveland.

Edited April 25 by WhiteSox2023

[bmags]

3 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Yeah, this is also why the pick is even riskier/scarier.  If you take a TE at #10, you should be getting the sure-fire consensus top TE of the draft.  Between Loveland and Warren, we don’t even know if that’s the case.  For reference, Brock Bowers was drafted at #13 last year and there was no doubt he was the stud TE of the draft.

Meanwhile, mentioning Sam LaPorta actually makes this pick look worse because he wasn’t taken until #34 in the 2nd round of the 2023 draft.

I would be very surprised if Poles couldn’t have traded down, got an extra pick, and still drafted Loveland.

 Not a lot of trade downs.

this draft just was really bad. I wouldn’t draft a TE at 10…but also it is unusual to be at 10 and have such a dearth of premium positions prospects with the appropriate size or not horrendous character flags. Ballard is a “premium position” guy and took a TE at 14. Probably one of the more popular trade downs rumors with the bears was with Denver…so they could take a TE.

Im just glad we didn’t trade up or do anything stupid. This felt like a 2013 draft where we’ll look back and just be amazed how few starters were available on the first round, let alone impact.

Id probably still have tried with Mykell Williams. But I’d have lower confidence he’d be a long term starter than Loveland.

[Chicago White Sox]

3 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Yeah, this is also why the pick is even riskier/scarier.  If you take a TE at #10, you should be getting the sure-fire consensus top TE of the draft.  Between Loveland and Warren, we don’t even know if that’s the case.  For reference, Brock Bowers was drafted at #13 last year and there was no doubt he was the stud TE of the draft.

Meanwhile, mentioning Sam LaPorta actually makes this pick look worse because he wasn’t taken until #34 in the 2nd round of the 2023 draft.

I would be very surprised if Poles couldn’t have traded down, got an extra pick, and still drafted Loveland.

Who was trading up and for what?  I don’t get how you can make these claims without being the war room or at least seeing other movements in that range.  It’s fine if you 

[Chicago White Sox]

9 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I keep seeing this cited, but LaPorta is just another example as to why you shouldn't invest tier 1 picks on TE's. Sam was the 34th pick in the draft.

Paying a premium for a TE when you're already paying a tight end is wild

First off, Johnson runs 12 personnel a ton and will be using two TE’s on the regular.  Second, Loveland is a different type of player than Kmet.  Cole is much more of a traditional inline TE whose priority is blocking, whereas Colston is a true move TE whose priority is receiving.  The reality is Loveland is basically a big slot receiver and takes away snaps from whomever our #3 WR is.  Both him and Kmet will be on the field at the same time a lot and having both gives Johnson tons of opportunities to create mismatches for opposing defenses, especially since Kmet is not a pure blocking TEs.  Whether that’s worthy of the #10 pick I don’t know, but I keep seeing people saying “why did we take a TE, we already have one” and that’s really missing the point of the pick.

Also, I don’t think you can look at past drafts and say this pick is too early because so and so went in a certain spot.  It’s very clear that the NFL is rethinking the value of move TEs.  Historically, TE’s have taken a long time to develop at the NFL level, but a lot of the more recent move TEs selected have produced within one or two years.  LaPorta and McBride were both 2nd round picks that had quick success and Bowers was a mid 1st round who immediately set records a rookie.  Given the type of impact these players are having, it’s only natural for the position to move up in terms of draft value.  Again, whether that means taking Loveland at #10 in a bad draft makes sense is still up for debate, but I don’t think anchoring off past draft tendencies doesn’t make sense in this case.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

44 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Who was trading up and for what?  I don’t get how you can make these claims without being the war room or at least seeing other movements in that range.  It’s fine if you 

For me, its just bad team building. You've already invested in tight end and this was a luxury pick you make if your roster is built and stacked.

[PaleAleSox]

44 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Who was trading up and for what?  I don’t get how you can make these claims without being the war room or at least seeing other movements in that range.  It’s fine if you 

I heard the Twins were offering a nice package but Poles didn't want it.

[Chicago White Sox]

6 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

For me, its just bad team building. You've already invested in tight end and this was a luxury pick you make if your roster is built and stacked.

See my last post.  I will disagree it’s a luxury pick.  Whether Loveland should be taken at #10 is a different debate, but the role he plays is critical for the offense Ben Johnson wants to run.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

11 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

First off, Johnson runs 12 personnel a ton and will be using two TE’s on the regular.  Second, Loveland is a different type of player than Kmet.  Cole is much more of a traditional inline TE whose priority is blocking, whereas Colston is a true move TE whose priority is receiving.  The reality is Loveland is basically a big slot receiver and takes away snaps from whomever our #3 WR is.  Both him and Kmet will be on the field at the same time a lot and having both gives Johnson tons of opportunities to create mismatches for opposing defenses, especially since Kmet is not a pure blocking TEs.  Whether that’s worthy of the #10 pick I don’t know, but I keep seeing people saying “why did we take a TE, we already have one” and that’s really missing the point of the pick.

Also, I don’t think you can look at past drafts and say this pick is too early because so and so went in a certain spot.  It’s very clear that the NFL is rethinking the value of move TEs.  Historically, TE’s have taken a long time to develop at the NFL level, but a lot of the more recent move TEs selected have produced within one or two years.  LaPorta and McBride were both 2nd round picks that had quick success and Bowers was a mid 1st round who immediately set records a rookie.  Given the type of impact these players are having, it’s only natural for the position to move up in terms of draft value.  Again, whether that means taking Loveland at #10 in a bad draft makes sense is still up for debate, but I don’t think anchoring off past draft tendencies doesn’t make sense in this case.

Name me another team who has invested this heavily in the tight end position. La Porta caught 60 balls for 700 yards as the only viable tight end for Johnson just last year. Now the bears have two tight ends. The production and value your going to get out of Loveland is so low. The bears have a nice receiving core, they need line help and depth. Poles is a disaster.

Also, Warren is arguably a better blocker which makes this even worse. And my guy, thr second tight end in Detroit last year had 17 combined targets. This idea that you need two tight ends in Johnson system is bs. Running 12 doesn't mean you need to invest big money and resources in two tight ends. Detroit offense was pretty good with Brock Wright as te2.

Edited April 25 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[Falstaff]

day 2 

Edited April 25 by Falstaff
typo

[PaleAleSox]

25 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Name me another team who has invested this heavily in the tight end position. La Porta caught 60 balls for 700 yards as the only viable tight end for Johnson just last year. Now the bears have two tight ends. The production and value your going to get out of Loveland is so low. The bears have a nice receiving core, they need line help and depth. Poles is a disaster.

Also, Warren is arguably a better blocker which makes this even worse. And my guy, thr second tight end in Detroit last year had 17 combined targets. This idea that you need two tight ends in Johnson system is bs. Running 12 doesn't mean you need to invest big money and resources in two tight ends. Detroit offense was pretty good with Brock Wright as te2.

I've read the complete opposite just about everywhere. 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

8 minutes ago, PaleAleSox said:

I've read the complete opposite just about everywhere. 

Not sure what you're reading but on about 10 analysis i read, even the ones that liked Loveland more, have the blocking edge to warren.

[bmags]

 

27 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Name me another team who has invested this heavily in the tight end position. La Porta caught 60 balls for 700 yards as the only viable tight end for Johnson just last year. Now the bears have two tight ends. The production and value your going to get out of Loveland is so low. The bears have a nice receiving core, they need line help and depth. Poles is a disaster.

Also, Warren is arguably a better blocker which makes this even worse. And my guy, thr second tight end in Detroit last year had 17 combined targets. This idea that you need two tight ends in Johnson system is bs. Running 12 doesn't mean you need to invest big money and resources in two tight ends. Detroit offense was pretty good with Brock Wright as te2.

Problem is drafting a bad player at a better position doesn’t help team building either.

They can also trade kmet.

this draft had 2 blue chip players, a bunch of good TEs/RBs, off-ball LBs and a bunch of tweeters at premium positions.

At least he is proper size and speed without character concerns.