4 hours ago, Sleepy Harold said:

I never said that the cap doesn't exist, I said its design is to suppress player wages. I for one am very interested in how the Mets will fair after blowing past what any team has done before. I know their base and market is excited, deservedly so. 

You do it like other leagues. You negotiate a set % of revenues, which determines the cap and cap floor. 

While I firmly believe teams are making gobs of money and in general should spend more. I don't think they can be blamed for not spending at the Mets level. I doubt revenues are that high to support a $420 mil payroll + tax (I think I heard 420 mil yesterday).

27 minutes ago, Sarava said:

You do it like other leagues. You negotiate a set % of revenues, which determines the cap and cap floor. 

While I firmly believe teams are making gobs of money and in general should spend more. I don't think they can be blamed for not spending at the Mets level. I doubt revenues are that high to support a $420 mil payroll + tax (I think I heard 420 mil yesterday).

I fear the Walmart type situation.  Walmart comes to town and all the little businesses go under.  Works great for the big guy...not so much for the little guy.  Most baseball owners have personal wealth ranging from 1 billion to 4 billion.  Cohen has wealth 5 to 20 times greater than his peers.  Not exactly a fair fight.  I don't want to turn the game into a battle of who can afford the biggest payroll.  That's not good for the game, or the fan.  I guess a league of 10 teams would work great for the players who make the cut, but two thirds of players will be left with no major league team to play for.

1 hour ago, Sarava said:

You do it like other leagues. You negotiate a set % of revenues, which determines the cap and cap floor. 

While I firmly believe teams are making gobs of money and in general should spend more. I don't think they can be blamed for not spending at the Mets level. I doubt revenues are that high to support a $420 mil payroll + tax (I think I heard 420 mil yesterday).

It’s a touchy subject. The Blackhawks got burned and the cap probably cost them another cup or two because they couldn’t pay their guys due to it. I think what this shows is owners make a lot more money then they want to admit. It never made sense. Big time businessmen spending billions for a business that was lucky to turn a profit, and the teams value just keeps increasing. JR has run his team like a mom and pop hot dog stand for 42 years, constantly saying that he breaks even at best yet it’s worth probably more than 100 times what he paid for it. He chose profit over winning. Runs the team anything but the large market they are. Could you imagine how bad his teams would be in Tampa if the state of Illinois didn’t build him a new stadium?  

 

San Francisco Giants-Sean Manaea 2 years/25 million with an opt out in the first year of the deal. That's a nice affordable signing. 

Edited December 12, 20223 yr by PolishPrince34
Forgot the team

27 minutes ago, PolishPrince34 said:

San Francisco Giants-Sean Manaea 2 years/25 million with an opt out in the first year of the deal. That's a nice affordable signing. 

He had a 5.00 era last year.  He is slow start from the pen and 12 months from being on a spring training invite.

The alleged impact from the bamtech windfall sure has changed the market.  If everyone was rolling in the dough I can't see 25-30 million in extra revenue this season changing things this much. 

That’s a good landing spot for Manaea. That ballpark should help him put up better numbers.

48 minutes ago, GREEDY said:

He had a 5.00 era last year.  He is slow start from the pen and 12 months from being on a spring training invite.

The alleged impact from the bamtech windfall sure has changed the market.  If everyone was rolling in the dough I can't see 25-30 million in extra revenue this season changing things this much. 

12 months away from a spring training invite? HUH-Way off on that one. 

Edited December 12, 20223 yr by PolishPrince34
Forgot

3 hours ago, Sarava said:

You do it like other leagues. You negotiate a set % of revenues, which determines the cap and cap floor. 

While I firmly believe teams are making gobs of money and in general should spend more. I don't think they can be blamed for not spending at the Mets level. I doubt revenues are that high to support a $420 mil payroll + tax (I think I heard 420 mil yesterday).

I agree that I don't envision multiple teams that would be willing to spend at the Mets (current) level, they could definitely spend more if they chose to do so. This is not directed at you but it's more of a general statement/thought I had, lets not act like if it were the White Sox spending gobs and gobs of money to bring in the best possible talent on the market that we'd be wanting a salary cap installed for "fairness". EVERY SINGLE ONE OF US would be loving them committing like that and it would be a "sucks to suck" for everyone else. 

23 minutes ago, PolishPrince34 said:

12 months away from a spring training invite? HUH-Way off on that one. 

I mean he got 2 years guaranteed so that was tongue and cheek.

In a year where the median era was under 4, if a veteran pitcher had a 5 era and then stunk it up in both the rotation and the pen the next year, he generally would be close to out of baseball.  

Manaea had two horrible outings last year. Take away the two outings against the Dodgers his  numbers would read 3.92 ERA and 3.76 FIP. He's a solid pitcher would of loved to added him. Later on it was identified he was tipping his pitches. 

Edited December 12, 20223 yr by PolishPrince34

16 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

I agree that I don't envision multiple teams that would be willing to spend at the Mets (current) level, they could definitely spend more if they chose to do so. This is not directed at you but it's more of a general statement/thought I had, lets not act like if it were the White Sox spending gobs and gobs of money to bring in the best possible talent on the market that we'd be wanting a salary cap installed for "fairness". EVERY SINGLE ONE OF US would be loving them committing like that and it would be a "sucks to suck" for everyone else. 

Agree with you 100%.  My issue is simply...it's not good for the long-term well-being of the sport.  I would love Elon Musk to buy the WS and that would be the AL version of the Mets.  It's a shame there isn't 30 of those types to go around.  Maybe Leury could be a 20 million per year guy if that was the case.

Just now, poppysox said:

Agree with you 100%.  My issue is simply...it's not good for the long-term well-being of the sport.  I would love Elon Musk to buy the WS and that would be the AL version of the Mets.  It's a shame there isn't 30 of those types to go around.  Maybe Leury could be a 20 million per year guy if that was the case.

These $50M payrolls I feel are worse for the sport. 

15 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

These $50M payrolls I feel are worse for the sport. 

yep, steve cohen spending like a mad man should put additional pressure on the assholes who own the teams to actually spend money, not the other way around. more teams spending like they're actually trying to win seems like it would be better for the sport.

25 minutes ago, PolishPrince34 said:

Manaea had two horrible outings last year. Take away the two outings against the Dodgers his  numbers would read 3.92 ERA and 3.76 FIP. He's a solid pitcher would of loved to added him. Later on it was identified he was tipping his pitches. 

Manaea wasn't even in the starting rotation for the Padres in the playoffs. His stuff decreased a lot as the season went on. Similar to what happened with Clevinger. The difference was that Clevinger was coming off TJS and Manaea wasn't. Him wearing down as the season goes on has kind of been a theme with him. 

4 minutes ago, Kalapse said:

yep, steve cohen spending like a mad man should put additional pressure on the assholes who own the teams to actually spend money, not the other way around. more teams spending like they're actually trying to win seems like it would be better for the sport.

A salary floor would be more beneficial than a max.  It's frustrating enough for us as Sox fans.  Imagine being a Pirates fan.  Imagine being a player and having a choice to play for a team like the Mets vs. a team like the Pirates.  Pretty obvious why Reynolds wants out of there.

2 minutes ago, hogan873 said:

A salary floor would be more beneficial than a max.  It's frustrating enough for us as Sox fans.  Imagine being a Pirates fan.  Imagine being a player and having a choice to play for a team like the Mets vs. a team like the Pirates.  Pretty obvious why Reynolds wants out of there.

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35 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

These $50M payrolls I feel are worse for the sport. 

I agree that a floor is needed at approximately$150 million.  

2 minutes ago, poppysox said:

I agree that a floor is needed at approximately$150 million.  

100 million would do a ton to solve some issues as well..  Gotta spend it, they won't just waste it on dumb players, they'll try to sign the best guys they can

Whatever salary cap they have in football and hockey are working for the health of the sport in that it limits the dynasty.

You tie profits to payroll; spend 50 mil on payroll then you get 50 mil cap in profit, rest goes to charity or the players.

 

I think right now sox fans are just on the short end of the stick. How many franchises feel hopeless? Probably us, rockies, oakland just because that relationship right now.

If you are pitt, you know it isn't great, but ben cherington is extremely smart and basically helped create a successful boston core that lasted a decade. And boston couldn't keep em either.

Tampa has competed. Milwaukee has competed. In many ways it's more competitive across cities than it is in the NBA, where the player salary compression reduces it to "where is the weather and city nicest".

Given how many baseball players are from southeast/west coast, do you want the midwest teams only offering the same as florida teams?

 

 

Teams should be able to throw the white flag after the 7th or 8th inning. It’s no longer fun or funny to see a position player pitch.

12 minutes ago, flavum said:

Teams should be able to throw the white flag after the 7th or 8th inning. It’s no longer fun or funny to see a position player pitch.

I think you have to play it out, but I do agree with your other point,  the position players pitching is tired and has to stop.