Moncada

[Chicago White Sox]

I wonder if he's recognizing that they're sliders and is having trouble fighting them off or if his pitch recognition is just wrong.

It’s a good question. Based on comments from both Ricky & Yoan, it sounds like there may be mechanical issues at play. And I’d prefer that over an inability to recognize the pitch.

[SonofaRoache]

HeGoan isn't struggling because it's cold. He's struggling because he has a steep learning curve for this country and the game of baseball here. He is young and will learn. I don't see him as a generational talent, but he can settle in hitting .275 with an OBP of 380. He will hit a ton of homers and doubles when he makes better contact. His defense has been surprisingly good though, which will add to his value.

Edited April 16, 2018 by SonofaRoache

[TaylorStSox]

It’s a good question. Based on comments from both Ricky & Yoan, it sounds like there may be mechanical issues at play. And I’d prefer that over an inability to recognize the pitch.

That's kind of my suspicion too, which is why I think he lacks the bat control to hit lead off. Obviously the team knows better than me though.

[TaylorStSox]

HeGoan isn't struggling because it's cold. He's struggling because he has a steep learning curve for this country and the game of baseball here. He is young and will learn. I don't see him as a generational talent, but he can settle in hitting .275 with an OBP of 380. He will hit a ton of homers and doubles when he makes better contact. His defense has been surprisingly good though, which will add to his value.

Good to know you're okay with your 2nd baseman playing good defense while getting on base at a .380 clip and hitting a "ton of homers."

[southsider2k5]

Good to know you're okay with your 2nd baseman playing good defense while getting on base at a .380 clip and hitting a "ton of homers."

 

That is basically Robinson Cano, with a bit better OBP, and a bit worse hitting.

[TheBlackSox8]

HeGoan isn't struggling because it's cold. He's struggling because he has a steep learning curve for this country and the game of baseball here. He is young and will learn. I don't see him as a generational talent, but he can settle in hitting .275 with an OBP of 380. He will hit a ton of homers and doubles when he makes better contact. His defense has been surprisingly good though, which will add to his value.

This will be his 4th year in America playing baseball. I think he knows what it's about. He's in a funk and struggling through the early season in cold weather? This is all a necessary part of experience in MLB.

The kid had a really good spring. In 80° weather.

[Lillian]

Let's not forget about Basabe. The Sale trade could well have netted us 3 starting and significant contributing pieces to the contending years, on the horizon.

Not only that, but they could be contributors at key positions; a middle infielder and lead off hitter, a centerfielder and a top of the rotation starter. That would be a very successful deal.

 

I wonder who is really more suitable as a centerfielder, between Robert and Basabe. It appears that they are both true centerfielders, who possess all of the tools to play there. I'm guessing that the 2020 outfield will consist of Robert, Eloy and Basabe, with Adolfo a close 4TH. What intrigues me about Basabe is that he appears to be a 5 tool, switch hitter, who is a legitimate centerfielder. That makes his success potentially more impactful than a player like Adolfo, who profiles more as a slugger.

Adolfo's arm in RF and Robert and Basabe patrolling CF and LF, would comprise a very good defensive outfield.

Who knows, maybe Eloy will end up at first base.

Edited April 16, 2018 by Lillian

[southsider2k5]

Let's not forget about Basabe. The Sale trade could well have netted us 3 starting and significant contributing pieces to the contending years, on the horizon.

Not only that, but they could be contributors at key positions; a middle infielder and lead off hitter, a centerfielder and top of the rotation starter. That would be a very successful deal.

 

I wonder who is really more suitable as a centerfielder, between Robert and Basabe. It appears that they are both true centerfielders, who possess all of the tools to play there. I'm guessing that the 2020 outfield will consist of Robert, Eloy and Basabe, with Adolfo a close 4TH. What intrigues me about Basabe is that he appears to be a 5 tool, switch hitter, who is a legitimate centerfielder. That makes his success potentially more impactful than a player like Adolfo, who profiles more as a slugger.

Adolfo's arm in RF and Robert and Basabe patrolling CF and LF, would comprise a very good defensive outfield.

Who knows, maybe Eloy will end up at first base.

 

And while he hasn't done much so far, we still have a guy like Victor Diaz floating in the system too as the 4th piece of that deal. He is a guy who can push 100mph out of the pen.

[SonofaRoache]

This will be his 4th year in America playing baseball. I think he knows what it's about. He's in a funk and struggling through the early season in cold weather? This is all a necessary part of experience in MLB.

The kid had a really good spring. In 80° weather.

 

 

He never consistently played over a full season. It was a few weeks then back down, most of the season down and the last month and a half up, and now a few weeks up again, Once he plays consistently over a season he will be more consistent. When he signed his deal a car dealership had to tell him to save his money and not blow it on cars. He still has a little maturing to do also.

Edited April 16, 2018 by SonofaRoache

[SonofaRoache]

Good to know you're okay with your 2nd baseman playing good defense while getting on base at a .380 clip and hitting a "ton of homers."

 

Without a doubt, very nice ceiling. But that is my opinion and hope, as there is no guarantee he may get to that level.

[greg775]

As a Sox fan, I give Moncada the benefit of the doubt. He passes the eye test to me and will be a good to great player. My question/concern would be however, something I'd have to be educated on.

 

What type of a person is he in terms of hard work/focus/caring? Isn't he the guy who was the subject of the long ESPN article on his Twinkies eating habits, etc? Wasn't that article kind of non flattering about his work ethic? Just asking.

 

If he is a hard worker, I think he should be fine. People should IMO just relax and watch. We're not winning anything anyway right now. I'll change my mind, however, if you tell me there's hard evidence he doesn't care/loafs, etc.

Edited April 16, 2018 by greg775

[Replacement Level Poster]

At this point I’m not the least bit concerned about Yoan. It’s not just that the weather has been terrible all spring by itself which is causing the struggle. Its as a result of the off days and postponements he and others have failed to find any timing or consistency in their swing and daily preparation in a game which is played nearly everyday for 8 months. Sometime this season he’s going to carry this team for a stretch. It will come quick. Older fans will remember how quick Ventura got it as a player. Had there a been a Soxtalk in 1990-91 we would have been having this conversation about Ventura. Then poof that July he caught fire check it out on Bbref. I still remember watching that walk off granny off gossage live. It was some fun.

 

We have about 6 yrs of control for moncada. For about two of those years he’ll still be developing at MLB level, for another two of those years he’ll probably come close to hitting his ceiling -think athletic talented 5-6 WAR type player. The other two years he’ll be in between. I think that is his most likely outcome.

 

Very few guys come up and dominate immediately and consistently like a Trout Or a Mookie Betts.

 

He’ll probably always k a lot and always hit better from the left side. That’s just the type of player he is....at least for the time being. The sooner the fan base accepts it the less frustrated they will be .

I’m actually more concerned about the focus issues.. the missed squeeze taking the Ofer to the field with him Thursday.

[chitownsportsfan]

It?€™s a good question. Based on comments from both Ricky & Yoan, it sounds like there may be mechanical issues at play. And I?€™d prefer that over an inability to recognize the pitch.

 

I mean I'm no baseball savant but in the postgamer (christ, what, 3 days ago...) I said it wasn't a mental issues so much as a "pulling off the ball issue".

 

And yes, as you noted, in the postgamer, at least the one Fegan wrote at the athletic (and awesome to see Jim M contributing to the athletic now) they both mentioned that he's pulling off the damn ball.

 

Moncada is gonna watch some pitches go by this year, many for strike three -- but not ripping cock shot 93 mph fastballs into the gap? that can't happen for him to succeed.

 

for whatever reason he's all out of sorts right now. it's been like 60 PA, there's plenty of time to right the ship this year and hell, in his career. Dude is 22 for another 40 days.

Edited April 17, 2018 by chitownsportsfan

[caulfield12]

With all the focus on Moncada/Gio, we've completely overlooked Engel and Avi...they ALSO deserve some scrutiny, right?

 

1/1 start, .630 OPS.

 

Call off the doomsayers for at least one game.

Edited April 17, 2018 by caulfield12

[Jose Abreu]

With all the focus on Moncada/Gio, we've completely overlooked Engel and Avi...they ALSO deserve some scrutiny, right?

Well Moncada and Giolito are cornerstones of the rebuild so I think the microscope is justified. Engel simply isn't an MLB player and I don't think anyone expects him to be here long term.

 

With regards to Avi, yes, his completely awful approach deserves scrutiny, but like Moncada, it's too early in the season to be a real issue.

[caulfield12]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/compare-yoan-m...-012809345.html

 

For some reason, they decided to compare the start of Paul Konerko's career to Yoan's...because they are completely similar players with similar backgrounds, lol

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

My perception at the time was most Sox fans were hoping for a deal centered around Swanson, Benintendi, or Bregman but all 3 were supposedly untouchable.

 

Right. I'm saying excluding those that were supposedly untouchable, nearly every mock deal I can remember centered around Maitan and/or Albies.

[Balta1701]

Right. I'm saying excluding those that were supposedly untouchable, nearly every mock deal I can remember centered around Maitan and/or Albies.

I thought Moncada was untouchable until the Red Sox actually made the deal.

[bmags]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/compare-yoan-m...-012809345.html

 

For some reason, they decided to compare the start of Paul Konerko's career to Yoan's...because they are completely similar players with similar backgrounds, lol

 

Or maybe it's a reminder that development isn't always linear.

[steveno89]

Or maybe it's a reminder that development isn't always linear.

 

Would it be out of the question to consider sending Moncada down to AAA for a bit?

[Chi Town Sox]

HeGoan isn't struggling because it's cold. He's struggling because he has a steep learning curve for this country and the game of baseball here. He is young and will learn. I don't see him as a generational talent, but he can settle in hitting .275 with an OBP of 380. He will hit a ton of homers and doubles when he makes better contact. His defense has been surprisingly good though, which will add to his value.

 

Those numbers sound like a generational 2B to me!

 

[Jack Parkman]

Is Yoan Moncada Cuban for Jurickson Profar? Inquiring minds want to know. Profar was the last consensus #1 prospect in baseball to completely bust, so it isn't like scouting fails don't still happen. What I don't understand is this: is the talent difference between AAA and the majors so huge that a player can hit .340+ in AAA and can't crack Mendoza in the bigs? It just seems impossible. Moncada was hitting .340 in mid June last year in AAA.

Edited April 17, 2018 by Jack Parkman

[bmags]

I'm old enough to remember when Byron Buxton was the last complete bust.

[Jack Parkman]

I'm old enough to remember when Byron Buxton was the last complete bust.

He might still be. He barely cracked .250. We're completely sure about Profar.

[bmags]

He might still be. He barely cracked .250. We're completely sure about Profar.

 

Ah, yes well if batting average is how we will judge Moncada's success then I imagine he will bust.