December 13, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, shago said: We're one of the only teams owned by a consortium of investors with a headline owner who doesn't actually have any cash. And this consortium of investors don't seem to give a crap about anything.
December 15, 20223 yr Spending a high first round pick, then all that time, effort and resources into developing, rehabbing and redeveloping him into the pitcher he had the potential to become, only to let him walk after the fruit ripened on the vine without offering even a QO is about the dumbest thing this org has done. Doesn’t matter how you rationalize it. Bursa surgery has a virtual 100% recovery rate and obviously pitchers often come back stronger than ever after TJS. After successful rehabilitation, which clearly occurred, a guy like Rodon is no riskier than any other pitcher. Dude is a horse. I bet he pitches until he’s forty
December 15, 20223 yr 5 minutes ago, FourEyesShottenhoffer said: Spending a high first round pick, then all that time, effort and resources into developing, rehabbing and redeveloping him into the pitcher he had the potential to become, only to let him walk after the fruit ripened on the vine without offering even a QO is about the dumbest thing this org has done. Doesn’t matter how you rationalize it. Bursa surgery has a virtual 100% recovery rate and obviously pitchers often come back stronger than ever after TJS. After successful rehabilitation, which clearly occurred, a guy like Rodon is no riskier than any other pitcher. Dude is a horse. I bet he pitches until he’s forty JR had an interesting comment along these lines. His "philosophy" hasn't changed has it? “Would you ever not be able to honor a contract like that? (i.e. a multi-year, big money deal) If people stopped coming to the games. If the television money went away. That’s why I don’t like to sign long term contracts with pitchers. It’s one thing to pay a pitcher five million dollars a year, but what if the guy can’t play?”–Jerry Reinsdorf, March 1994, to Bob Greene. From the book ‘Rebound, The Odyssey of Michael Jordan’ by Bob Greene. Pg. 65. Published 1995.
December 15, 20223 yr 53 minutes ago, shago said: So you agree? I was arguing the opposite point so I thought the double negative was a better way to validate the point that poster made. Yes, I agree with that post. Edited December 15, 20223 yr by Jack Parkman
December 15, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Lip Man 1 said: JR had an interesting comment along these lines. His "philosophy" hasn't changed has it? “Would you ever not be able to honor a contract like that? (i.e. a multi-year, big money deal) If people stopped coming to the games. If the television money went away. That’s why I don’t like to sign long term contracts with pitchers. It’s one thing to pay a pitcher five million dollars a year, but what if the guy can’t play?”–Jerry Reinsdorf, March 1994, to Bob Greene. From the book ‘Rebound, The Odyssey of Michael Jordan’ by Bob Greene. Pg. 65. Published 1995. Doesn’t have the same issue paying his crony general managers and managers millions of dollars despite the fact they can’t perform their jobs. If Tony’s doctors didn’t shut him down he’d still be here, and for as long as Tony damn well pleased. The fans have increasingly stopped going to games because of signing poor management, not because of player injuries which happen across baseball every season.
December 15, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said: Doesn’t have the same issue paying his crony general managers and managers millions of dollars despite the fact they can’t perform their jobs. If Tony’s doctors didn’t shut him down he’d still be here, and for as long as Tony damn well pleased. The fans have increasingly stopped going to games because of signing poor management, not because of player injuries which happen across baseball every season. You really believe his doctor's shut him down?
December 15, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Texsox said: You really believe his doctor's shut him down? If they didn't, I am fine with whoever did.
December 15, 20223 yr 25 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: If they didn't, I am fine with whoever did. So am I. But as you pointed out his travel schedule seemed pretty full in the weeks after "leaving the team". I want to think the team convinced him to leave / fired him.
December 15, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, Texsox said: So am I. But as you pointed out his travel schedule seemed pretty full in the weeks after "leaving the team". I want to think the team convinced him to leave / fired him. It is entirely plausible that the organization preplanned an exit strategy together.
December 15, 20223 yr 22 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: It is entirely plausible that the organization preplanned an exit strategy together. Hard to imagine how brutal the fan base would be right now had Tony not gotten fired….errrrr, stepped down.
December 15, 20223 yr I believe that he stepped down due to health issues, but it's also notable that in his final press conference, he admitted that the fan discontentment might have led him to step down regardless
December 15, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said: Hard to imagine how brutal the fan base would be right now had Tony not gotten fired….errrrr, stepped down. I'll be honest, not sure it can get much worse than right now. My excitement level, along with my "faith" in this organization to show any interest in trying to win a World Series is at an all-time low, truly.
December 15, 20223 yr 2 hours ago, Texsox said: You really believe his doctor's shut him down? Most plausible explanation. Jerry is the only person who could fire him. The doctors were right. Tony appeared sober and lucid at his final press conference for the first time. He needed massive doses of rest and detoxification. He would have likely died or become permanently incapacitated if he tried to finish his announced contract with the same lifestyle as he the first two (long work days, his age, his "self-medicating", etc.). Sure this was also the right call beyond never considering him two years ago, but Hahn needed to leave (and Kenny retire) for the Sox to have a clean slate and either try to win in 2023/2024 or plan for an actual competitive window starting 2025/2026, with a competent front office.
December 15, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: I believe that he stepped down due to health issues, but it's also notable that in his final press conference, he admitted that the fan discontentment might have led him to step down regardless Hmmmmmm.
January 25, 20233 yr In times like these, this thread needs to either be pinned or bumped to page one daily. That is all.
January 25, 20233 yr 4 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said: In times like these, this thread needs to either be pinned or bumped to page one daily. That is all. I confess that I always have to reserve my frustration to the organization as a whole more than for Hahn. They began the rebuild, then gave Hahn fake carte blanche to finish it off will the il- fated free agency follies. Perhaps Hahn should be more creative to get out of the handcuffs that have been placed on him. But this season has clearly ended the questions of whether or not he’s been saddled with limits placed on him. We were given false hope. I have to face it, and just wish for pop up seasons to support my Sox fandom. I may get excited the next time they engage in a full rebuild around a new wave of youth. Hopefully they do a better job of scouting cheap young talent to enjoy before getting shipped out when it needs to get paid.
January 25, 20233 yr How about we launch the entire organisation into the sun? Hahn is enmeshed in the disfunction, but he’s the tip of the iceberg.
January 25, 20233 yr I think you'd be hard pressed to find a worse General Manager. Certainly in White Sox history, but even throughout the game he has to be up there.
January 25, 20233 yr 1 hour ago, TheBooneLoganEra said: I think you'd be hard pressed to find a worse General Manager. Certainly in White Sox history, but even throughout the game he has to be up there. The Hahn era has been an absolute and utter failure, yet you still have people defending him like hes the smartest man in the game. I dont get it.
January 25, 20233 yr Hahn sucks. He should be fired. Kenny sucks. He should be fired. Jerry sucks. He should sell. Thoughts are all valid and not mutually exclusive. However, MAYBE if Jerry hired better management over the years we wouldn't be as pissed at him. Like say, if they could develop players from their minors like the 90s Braves did or the Rays do now. A team with an analytics infrastructure like Tampa and the ability to have a $150M payroll could be a sleeping giant (I'm taking $30M from payroll and investing it in other places in baseball ops) My issue with Jerry isn't about what he spends or doesn't spend, but rather that he needs to pick a damn lane. Dude is stuck operating in the late 20th century. He needs to join the 21st century. If the budget really is a sticking point, then the prudent thing to do is operate like the Rays but with more cash. Maybe you don't have to trade players as soon as they reach arb 2 like clockwork, but don't let anyone leave for nothing and be willing to make hard decisions. Again, my issue isn't with the budget but rather how they're using it. Edited January 25, 20233 yr by Jack Parkman
January 25, 20233 yr How can Hahn suck if he won the best GM of the year award just a few seasons ago!?!?
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