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I hope he gets hotter than shit, gets traded for that top 50 kid in LA, then comes back on a 5 year 10 million dollar deal and wins 5 WS.

I sadly don’t think they’ll sign a big fish... ever. My hopes this past offseason were forever crushed. Missing Harper AND Machado In a year they had planned for repeatedly... I’ll never recover from that kick in the balls.

I’m not saying he’s right or wrong but it was very telling. It’s almost like Steve Stone has now replaced Hawk as Reinsdorf’s personal mouthpiece.

Exactly. So will everyone complaining.

robots.

h He ain't a bum... but .189 572 OPS in July .125 489 OPS since all star break.

Vilehoopster doesn't like facts. He likes to live in fantasy land

Its almost like him hitting nearly 100 points above his career average for a couple months wasn't sustainable with a giant babip.

OK, a lot to unpack here, but I divided up your post into the 3 ideas that bear analysis, IMO. On #1, the lesson that should have been learned by this front office is to know when you have scant competition for a player's signature, and when there will be PILES of teams trying to sign a player. In the cases of Abreu and Robert, there were few suitors, and NONE among the moneyed class of MLB. For that matter, there was scant competition for Machado and Harper, but they fvkced that one up, unfortunately. Turning to THIS offseason, for Cole's signature, I can envision the yankmees, the scrubs, Atlanta, Philly, and Texas, and LAAAA all being interested, and all having more money to spend, and all being closer to competing than the SOX. Part of winning FA is identifying the player, and part of it is signability. If you've been a shitty team for a decade, AND reluctant to spend, your chances to sign top talent in FA are remote. [Unless there are few competing suitors.] On #2, I don't think that the free agencies of yesteryear are all that cogent to today's discussion, in all honesty. There are MASSIVE differences in the CBAs, for example. [Dye would have had a draft pick attached to him, were he a FA today.] There aren't NEARLY as many stupid front offices in MLB as there was when AJP was stupidly given away for free. Were it TODAY, the SFGs would have rightly tried to keep AJP to rebuild his value, THEN trade him away. As for Fisk, that was so long ago, if memory serves, he was only a FA because he came off an injury. Free agency [both MLB veterans and International FA] have long been a massive failing by this front office. Lastly, on #3, this front office crapped their pants on the pursuit of Machado. In no way was their incentives-based deal a good one for Machado. And in no way was this org worrying about a $300MM guarantee cogent, given the natural inflation of top player salaries and the $/WAR for either one. Sorry, but it was a MASSIVE fuckup, and one that will haunt this team for a long time. There won't be another 26 year old stud available in FA for YEARS. There won't be another 26 year old stud, AND none of the RICH teams interested/involved for decades. If you want to behave like a "small market team," then you'd better learn to strike when you can. This front office has earned the criticism and scorn, and we are RIGHT to pile it on them until they prove otherwise.

Shouldn't Abreau count? 6 year $68 million was a pretty ballsy move in 2013 for a guy that never played in the majors. And Robert's $52 million deal (26 mill signing bonus and $26 mill tax)...for a 19 year old. And with each era...Fisk, Dye, AJ...they had big contributors that were free agents. I know it doesn't fit the sites narrative to suggest that this front office IS trying and some of their moves aren't terrible but the negativity is overwhelming. I think they DID try hard...for Machado...they offered according to Ken Rosenthal...$250 m with incentives to get to $350m plus two of his best friends and his brother in law. A confident betting man takes the chance at $350 with the downside being generational wealth. He chose sunny California and the bigger guarantee. Either choice was not wrong for Manny. But too many on here think the Sox made a stupid offer...there was always only going to be one winner for Machado. As for Harper...I think it was reasonable not to pay the guy $350 m. There are currently 13 outfielders that have a higher OPS than him....he's basically having the same year as Marcell Ozuna. I think keeping your power dry for when you REALLY need it (they weren't ready this year even with one of those two) makes sense. That said...they'd better spend it this year. I just think they will and think it's unfair to suggest they never will.

Just being honest - but before I believe they won't fuck it up, I actually need to see some proof.

Wow. that's pretty fast. Must not have been a very serious one. It's a good sign for his future health and injuries to the joint.

I don’t see how you can shred a comment like this. Hahn brought in Nova, Santana, and Banuelos this past offseason as rotation guys. Did he intentionally waste $9 million on Nova thinking he would be bad? No, he thought he would be a good #4/#5 starter. He has brought in other such trash over the past few years (Paulino, Noesi, Latos, Santiago, Holland, MiGo) as rotation solutions. Did he intentionally sign the worst possible answers for his rotations? What big name starting pitchers has Hahn signed/acquired from outside the Sox organization? Big Game James nearing his retirement? Sure, Hahn will supposedly have more money to spend next offseason but does anyone trust him to spend it wisely? Why is there any reason to trust him going forward when it comes to free agency?

Maybe this was posted elsewhere but as someone that's in between Gen X and Gen Z (older millenial) I found his comments spot fucking on.

Social media was a mistake

The only conclusion is the White Sox really didn’t want Machado all that badly. It doesn’t make sense, because of the courting of Alonso and Jay, but then why would they have telegraphed the move of Moncada to third (Machado’s best position)...? it was all to light a fire under Yoan and Timmy? Because if you want to make it clear to Machado that he’s wanted...you don’t move one of the best young players in the game to his natural position. It’s not like he was wedded to playing SS either, as he made it abundantly clear he was willing to move back to 3B. Ironically, the player they most needed was Harper (from a positional standpoint), and they barely paid lip service to that possibility after the initial meetings.

Can we not talk about how much payroll the Padres might have available ever again?

The other thing to remember with Baines is that he missed portions of three seasons to strikes, 1981 and 1994-95. Plug that playing time back in and he's over 3000 hits and right at 400 homers. How many more hits and home runs would Baines likely have logged? Using simple "on pace" calculations: 1981: 40 hits, 5 HR 1994: 51 hits, 7 HR 1995: 14 hits, 3 HR That'd bring Baines to 2,971 hits and 399 home runs. He'd get my vote either way, but his odds would probably be considerably better with those numbers literally scratching at Cooperstown's door.

Greg read your well thought out post about Bummer's value. He digested it, learned from it, and then did some research on Bummer's statistics. He had a change of heart based on the information and statistics at hand.

I know a lot of fans want a Hall of Great Stats and anything that can't be measured and ranked doesn't matter. I believe it is a Hall of Fame and a person's overall contribution to the game of baseball should be taken into account. Baines is a credit to the game of baseball. He played with all the great qualities you want in a player. He never disrespected the game by cheating, doing drugs, didn't gamble on baseball, he was a player that truly was a great role model on and off the field. The HoF would be an even bigger farce if they didn't recognize who builds the game up. I believe the Hall is a better place with him enshrined. Parents won't have to shield their children's eyes from the reality of the man when they visit.

Gladney Bomb #6. Ties the game in the 9th.

By injuries did you mean “way too small. Outfielders will never respect him and play 7 infielders so his OPS will never be high enough and he doesn’t strike out or walk enough too small to function waste of a 4th pick, you need to get higher Ceiling at #4 even though the last 10 #4 picks have almost all amounted to complete shit, hold my beer while I go slap him around and teach him how to hit homers”?

The idea of this thread is perfect. Cole would make us world series contenders tomorrow.

In 2006 I saw the Sox play in Pittsburgh. I went with my dad. He's the reason I'm a Sox fan and we used to make occasional trips to road Sox games. Anyway during the first game of the series he got a foul ball. He gave it to me. He passed away in 2017. Sometimes it's not the most expensive piece or the one you worked hardest for but instead the most symbolic.

What does the 2017 draft have to do with anything?

We can easily afford to add $100 million per year in payroll. Even if we elect to pay a Cole type in the vicinity of $30 million per year that still leaves $70 million per year for a lesser starter, a right fielder and several very good relievers and several nice extensions. I think Jerry is prepared to spend the money but probably not all his eggs in just a couple of baskets. That's not necessarily wrong.

He was a week from 83 at the time of the Manny debacle.

If the White Sox want a 2 WAR OF, they should simply sign Castellanos in the offseason. Should only cost money since I can’t see the Tigers extending a QO. Puig would be an option as well.

Funny how quickly things change. 3 months ago nearly all White Sox fans would have gladly traded Moncada for Benintendi. Now I’m not sure I’d even give up Andrew Vaughn for Benintendi.

Ok fine, that is true, and I agree, but wasn't your premise and question what position player would you add?

Injuries, as were discussed.

I love Harold Baines. He is not a HOF player. If he didn't wreck his knee, maybe. When he was mobile, he could really play RF like nobody's business.

But why was he promoted in the first place?!

Ummmm. .... why would anyone pick anyone other than Mike Trout?

I think it's time for Madrigal to move to Triple-A.

No chance

I think we can get him, and there is no excusable reason why we can't. I would definitely appreciate it if the Yankees and Phillies went and got SP at the deadline though to lessen their chances at being serious suiters.

All good points. Many of the signs would point to the Sox not signing Cole so it’s strange to see people who are actually optimistic about the possibility.

Im frankly stunned that this thread has been made by this particular poster, after this past offseason's FAILURE. I'm not picking on anyone when I post this, but let's put this fantasy to bed once and for all. As I see it, there are [AT LEAST] 3 reasons why this will never happen: 1. As many have posted here, they will be MANY suitors for Cole. Most will offer more money, & are better positioned to win NOW. For a player like Cole, this is important. 2. JR/KW/RH will always find a way to screw this up. They are incompetent and mentally weak. They are also more interested in the Reinsdorf family's future inheiritance. 3. Cole is a Scott Boras client. In a competitive situation, Boras uses the SOX as leverage. In my view, thinking about Cole coming here is a waste of time, in all honesty. It's a whole pile of mental masturbation.

Next offseason, we will all get excited once again about the chance at signing a big name like Gerrit Cole and Hahn will wind up signing a second tier “value guy” like Alex Wood.

They have to sign Cole. The payroll is so low. No more of these Santana, Nova, Shields, Detwiler, Banuelos types. Sign Cole and a back-end starter.

Sox arent landing Cole, dont do this to yourselves

I'm with ya. He can be our Lester, except he's better.

He’s now 83 years old, not sure suppressing player salaries is high on his to-do list at the moment.

Soxtalk for ya.

Well I feel like the Yankees and a few other teams can go 7/210 no problem. Why pick the Sox in that case?

I've been a White Sox fan for more than 50 years and I loved Harold Baines. But there is no way he is a Hall of Famer. It's easy to get emotional when a player is from your team, but in this case I have to defer to the impartial national media, who almost unanimously agree that Harold doesn't belong. He never got more than 6% of the vote when he was eligible, for goodness sake.

As are most baseball experts, it's really hard to justify his induction by any metric other than he played a really long time. But the HOF has become a farce anyway, so I digress.

LOL. Not that the Hall of Fame had much credibility left, but it's gotta be all gone now.