... it's about time

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

I"m combining three threads. We don't need a new thread every time someone else wants to b**** about the same stuff.

We need Jason in here calling Ozzie an assclown again

[StrangeSox]

Seriously, that's nearly all this forum has on it recently, no one is censoring s***.

 

This forum's had a strong anti-ozzie contingent pretty much since I joined.

[Milkman delivers]

Hopefully today is just Rios's send off for the 2011 season. Unless he goes 4-4 with 6 homeruns, he should never see the field again after today, and if he does I will not be watching the rest of the season.

 

[Dick Allen]

It did take Viciedo 3 AB to match Dunn's hit total vs. LHP this season.

[Quin]

What a noob....after awhile this site can get quite boring with so few subjects. BTW, unless you own the site, anyone and anything can be censored.

 

But I enjoy his newsletters.

 

Seriously, that's nearly all this forum has on it recently, no one is censoring s***.

 

I love how you say that...then s*** gets censored at the end of your sentence.

[shago]

An average (strong statement) shortstop: career .264 AVG 28 HRs 169 SBs (108 CS) and an overrated fielder in 16 MLB seasons. Only 2 playoff performances as a manager of one of the highest payroll clubs in a lousy division in his tenure as manager including an '05 club that won despite him and had chemistry because of players like Rowand and Crede who truly kept the clubhouse 'loose' according to most recounts of our miraculous run. I don't get it. After games like tonight (8/31), who actually can still support this guy? Not to mention a foul-mouthed jerk.......

[Marty34]

You have identified half the problem. The other half is the GM.

[Rowand44]

You're preaching to the choir. I'd say about 98 percent of this board at this point realizes that Ozzie is incompetent.

[Marty34]

You're preaching to the choir. I'd say about 98 percent of this board at this point realizes that Ozzie is incompetent.

 

. . . while less than 10% recognizes Williams' incompetency.

[That funky motion]

I remember when we won in 05 I said, I wouldn't complain about Ozzie again. I think it was by the 3rd game in 06, I was complaining again. He drives me crazy!!!!

[Rowand44]

. . . while less than 10% recognizes Williams' incompetency.

Before this season, Kenny still had a lot of Sox fans on his side, at this point, a LOT more than 10 percent want him gone.

[LittleHurt05]

Do you really have to ask this question??

 

In 1917 the Sox won it all. In the 88 years after that, they made the playoffs 5 times, the WS 2 times, and that's it. Zero championships. That's a struggling franchise. Until 2005.

 

Look at how people adore Ditka in Chicago. He won one Super Bowl but should have won more with the teams he had. He is royalty around here.

 

If the Cubs ever win it all, their manager or GM could pull an OJ two years after, and most of Chicago would forgive him.

[chw42]

Before this season, Kenny still had a lot of Sox fans on his side, at this point, a LOT more than 10 percent want him gone.

 

I would like this organization to just clean house. But if I had a choice of who to get rid of, it's easily Ozzie.

 

It's true that KW has made some really bad moves lately, but he's still a competent GM to a degree. Ozzie on the other hand...no.

[shago]

Do you really have to ask this question??

 

In 1917 the Sox won it all. In the 88 years after that, they made the playoffs 5 times, the WS 2 times, and that's it. Zero championships. That's a struggling franchise. Until 2005.

 

Look at how people adore Ditka in Chicago. He won one Super Bowl but should have won more with the teams he had. He is royalty around here.

 

If the Cubs ever win it all, their manager or GM could pull an OJ two years after, and most of Chicago would forgive him.

Let's not bring Iron Mike into this... Couple things, one, Ditka was a great player for the Bears. Two, he had a much better fashion sense with those sweaters and a great mustache. Three, he cooks some mean ribs at his restaurant. Four, he could call the 3-4 HB trap on first down better than any coach in NFL history. Five, the Cubs will never win the World Series again....................

[greg775]

An average (strong statement) shortstop: career .264 AVG 28 HRs 169 SBs (108 CS) and an overrated fielder in 16 MLB seasons. Only 2 playoff performances as a manager of one of the highest payroll clubs in a lousy division in his tenure as manager including an '05 club that won despite him and had chemistry because of players like Rowand and Crede who truly kept the clubhouse 'loose' according to most recounts of our miraculous run. I don't get it. After games like tonight (8/31), who actually can still support this guy? Not to mention a foul-mouthed jerk.......

 

I like Ozzie.

In my mind he was a good shortstop and a fun player to follow. I wouldn't call him an overrated fielder either. He was a good fielder. People on this board act like he hit like Mark Belanger and fielded like Bee Bee Richard. He was a good player.

Our 05 team won in spite of him ... sure it did. Bulls***. He led us to the city's only WS title in about 80 years.

I think his quotes are funny.

 

And he's young. He's learned a lot here. It ain't really his fault he can't work with KW. The two are like oil and water. Those are facts. I hope they both get canned, not just one.

Because of that they deserve to get axed. Jerry should have yelled at them both last year and said if they didn't grow up and work together and meet once a week in a civil setting they were GONE.

But Oz WAS a good player and IS a good manager ... IMO.

Edited September 1, 2011 by greg775

[knightni]

Let's not bring Iron Mike into this... Couple things, one, Ditka was a great player for the Bears. Two, he had a much better fashion sense with those sweaters and a great mustache. Three, he cooks some mean ribs at his restaurant. Four, he could call the 3-4 HB trap on first down better than any coach in NFL history. Five, the Cubs will never win the World Series again....................

Won Rookie of the Year in Chicago

Selected to multiple All Star Games/Pro Bowls as player in Chicago

Won seminal World Title as coach/manager

Very charismatic

Person you/the media think(s) of when they think Chicago coaching history

Has a snappy mustache

 

 

[JohnCangelosi]

Let's not bring Iron Mike into this... Couple things, one, Ditka was a great player for the Bears. Two, he had a much better fashion sense with those sweaters and a great mustache. Three, he cooks some mean ribs at his restaurant. Four, he could call the 3-4 HB trap on first down better than any coach in NFL history. Five, the Cubs will never win the World Series again....................

 

 

[JohnCangelosi]

I like Ozzie.

In my mind he was a good shortstop and a fun player to follow. I wouldn't call him an overrated fielder either. He was a good fielder. People on this board act like he hit like Mark Belanger and fielded like Bee Bee Richard. He was a good player.

Our 05 team won in spite of him ... sure it did. Bulls***. He led us to the city's only WS title in about 80 years.

I think his quotes are funny.

 

And he's young. He's learned a lot here. It ain't really his fault he can't work with KW. The two are like oil and water. Those are facts. I hope they both get canned, not just one.

Because of that they deserve to get axed. Jerry should have yelled at them both last year and said if they didn't grow up and work together and meet once a week in a civil setting they were GONE.

But Oz WAS a good player and IS a good manager ... IMO.

Greg, you have to admit Ozzie is a horrible tactician. This board could have made better decisions with the bullpen, pulling out starters, and putting in pinch hitters better than Ozzie. For the record, I do like Ozzie as a personality and as the "boss" in the clubhouse. If we get another Jerry Manuel or Gene Lamont next year I'll puke- so from that standpoint I really do like Ozzie. But until he gets a bench coach with a brain that he'll listen to or grow a brain himself I don't see how he'll make it much longer. Batting Rios in the 4 slot is just awful. Pinch hitting for Kittlebridge yesterday was even worse.

[Texsox]

Because some on the board realize that players have to play. couldn't win consistently with the types of seasons some very key players have had.

[Lemon_44]

Greg, you have to admit Ozzie is a horrible tactician. This board could have made better decisions with the bullpen, pulling out starters, and putting in pinch hitters better than Ozzie. For the record, I do like Ozzie as a personality and as the "boss" in the clubhouse. If we get another Jerry Manuel or Gene Lamont next year I'll puke- so from that standpoint I really do like Ozzie. But until he gets a bench coach with a brain that he'll listen to or grow a brain himself I don't see how he'll make it much longer. Batting Rios in the 4 slot is just awful. Pinch hitting for Kittlebridge yesterday was even worse.

Being a tactician is ,in my opinion, so overrated. The key part about being a manager is managing the clubhouse. Just because a guy can make a double switch doesn't mean he's a good manager. I think OG does a great job in the clubhouse. He keeps the heat off the players and let's them play the game. Other than some lapses by Rios, the team plays the game the right way. They just need to execute better.

[Carlo Paz]

"People on this board act like he hit like Mark Belanger... He was a good player."

 

Funny you should use Belanger as a benchmark for futility. He clearly was a terrible hitter with a lifetime batting average of .228, yet he STILL was able to muster a .300 on base percentage compared to Ozzie's historically horrible .287 OBP. When I watched Ozzie as a player, I was always frustrated because as a mediocre hitter with little power but some speed (before his injury), his value to the team would have been optimized by getting on base...something he basically refused to do. To me Ozzie was the guy at work *wheeee* having a great time while everyone else has to bust there ass to cover up for his sloppy work. (Belanger's Win Probability Added was -10.15, Ozzie's was -21.51, so yeah, one of the worst hitters of all time was still good for 11 more wins than Ozzie).

Edited September 1, 2011 by Carlo Paz

[Rowand44]

I like Ozzie.

In my mind he was a good shortstop and a fun player to follow. I wouldn't call him an overrated fielder either. He was a good fielder. People on this board act like he hit like Mark Belanger and fielded like Bee Bee Richard. He was a good player.

Our 05 team won in spite of him ... sure it did. Bulls***. He led us to the city's only WS title in about 80 years.

I think his quotes are funny.

 

And he's young. He's learned a lot here. It ain't really his fault he can't work with KW. The two are like oil and water. Those are facts. I hope they both get canned, not just one.

Because of that they deserve to get axed. Jerry should have yelled at them both last year and said if they didn't grow up and work together and meet once a week in a civil setting they were GONE.

But Oz WAS a good player and IS a good manager ... IMO.

I don't even know why I bother to respond to you because you're so blinded when it comes to Ozzie. But the fact that you believe he's batting Rios 4th to spite KW and also believe that he's a good manager is truly one of the more insane opinions I've ever seen on this board.

 

Because some on the board realize that players have to play. couldn't win consistently with the types of seasons some very key players have had.

If only he'd actually let his best players play...

 

Being a tactician is ,in my opinion, so overrated. The key part about being a manager is managing the clubhouse. Just because a guy can make a double switch doesn't mean he's a good manager. I think OG does a great job in the clubhouse. He keeps the heat off the players and let's them play the game. Other than some lapses by Rios, the team plays the game the right way. They just need to execute better.

The White Sox haven't played the game of baseball the correct way in years now, no freakin clue what team you're watching. And it's one thing to not be a great tactician but it's another thing to make moves that are just plain idiotic. Pinch hitting Adam Dunn in a key situation for Lilli and batting Rios 4th are literally some of the dumbest moves you'll ever see a manager make.

 

[Chicago White Sox]

Let's be honest, there are only three reasons people still like Ozzie at this point:

 

1) He's a proven winner by winning the World Series in 2005

 

2) He's very entertaining and says many silly/funny things

 

3) He keeps the clubhouse loose by putting the attention on himself

 

Unfortunately, #2 has nothing to with winning and is a terrible reason to keep him as manager, yet people like greg deem it important. #1 is no longer relevant, since Ozzie's team have underperformed since 2005 and his arrogance has grown exponentially, which has resulted in some terrible tactical decisions just so he can put his stamp on the game. Even #3 no longer seems to be the case, whether it be his public fights with KW, his son airing the clubhouse's dirty laundry, or him demanding an extension during the final stretch of the season while being six games, his act has grown tiresome for the fans and I'd have to guess the players feel the same way.

 

Plain and simple, Ozzie is a TERRIBLE manger and needs to go. Thanks for 2005, you had a good year then, but now it's time for change.

[Cerbaho-WG]

Being a tactician is ,in my opinion, so overrated. The key part about being a manager is managing the clubhouse. Just because a guy can make a double switch doesn't mean he's a good manager. I think OG does a great job in the clubhouse. He keeps the heat off the players and let's them play the game. Other than some lapses by Rios, the team plays the game the right way. They just need to execute better.

 

 

What in God's name are you smoking?

[southsider2k5]

. . . good way to keep the KoolAid flowing, Northside . . . can anyone say censorship? . . .

 

. . . Sox fans won't be silenced. We're tired of the Kenny/Ozzie game; this year it finally went beyond mere entertainment to distraction and finally to open warfare as Ozzie used the baseball team to try to embarrass Williams. So much for being a professional.

 

It is clear one - or both - of these guys needs to go. Ozzie's the likely candidate. The players have clearly already tuned him out, as we're in the second year of unbelievably poor starts out of the gate and complete underachievement over the 162 game season.

 

You don't get out much, do you?