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BigHurt3515

Abreu Signs 3/$50M Extension

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6 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said:

Take the emotions of this Abreu contract, and the emotions of signing the Grandal contract and meet in the middle. That's where your heads should be at. 

Neither are winning or losing us a Championship. These are Tier 2 guys (Jose in his age is a Tier 2 guy). You need a number of these solid, dependable veterans on a winning team. 

The key still remains having a few guys breakout into Tier 1 stars. So far it looks like we have a few of those guys and we just have to hope they continue to develop. 

If we do those things we should be in a good position in a few years to go out and sprinkle in what you need at the time via minor league depth - whether that be a speed guy, a bullpen arm, a LHB, a Power bat, a contact guy, a TOR starter .... whatever the situation calls for. 

Don't worry - this is alright. We are still on the same path as long. Jerry paying Jose in 2022 shouldn't hold us back from spending to put together a championship roster in 2022. If it does, then we never really had a shot to begin. You either believe the money is there to spend or you don't. I'm cautiously optimistic. 

Nothing about Grandal is a tier 2 player. He’s been most one of the most valuable guys in baseball over the past five years.

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This deal is absolutely disastrous for the team. There is a high chance his last year is a complete sunken cost. This could be the difference between an ace and a low end starter. The difference between going to the world series and actually winning the damn thing. What a horrible, horrible deal. 

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8 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Hahn is a Cuck for allowing his Boss to make the final decision. Good stuff.

I wish you were my analyst and would go to bat for me as much as you do for every employee of the White Sox.

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Certainly seems like a slight overpay and totally has Jerry’s fingerprints all over it. I’m not too worried this is going to handcuff the Sox in 2 years though. 

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11 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said:

Take the emotions of this Abreu contract, and the emotions of signing the Grandal contract and meet in the middle. That's where your heads should be at. 

Neither are winning or losing us a Championship. These are Tier 2 guys (Jose in his age is a Tier 2 guy). You need a number of these solid, dependable veterans on a winning team. 

The key still remains having a few guys breakout into Tier 1 stars. So far it looks like we have a few of those guys and we just have to hope they continue to develop. 

If we do those things we should be in a good position in a few years to go out and sprinkle in what you need at the time via minor league depth - whether that be a speed guy, a bullpen arm, a LHB, a Power bat, a contact guy, a TOR starter .... whatever the situation calls for. 

Don't worry - this is alright. We are still on the same path as long. Jerry paying Jose in 2022 shouldn't hold us back from spending to put together a championship roster in 2022. If it does, then we never really had a shot to begin. You either believe the money is there to spend or you don't. I'm cautiously optimistic. 

Grandal is arguably the most complete catcher in baseball.  Nothing about him is "Tier 2".

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2 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Nothing about Grandal is a tier 2 player. He’s been most one of the most valuable guys in baseball over the past five years.

Everybody is free to their opinion. My personal Tier 1 doesn't have one Sox player in it. My tier 1 is reserved for players like Trout and Bregman and Bellinger and Betts, etc. As well as Verlander and Coles of the world. 

i would say we potentially have difference makers like that in Eloy, Kopech, Giolito, Yoan and Robert. 

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22 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I'd hazard an educated guess that it's about 100.  Replacement level DH.  He's under performed his projections two years running.  So you need to be quite optimistic to think he'll get 6+ war.  

Not to mention is a terrible defensive 1B who has repeatedly said in the past that he does not want to DH full time (I can easily see Ricky playing him too much 1B with Vaughn down the road) and is a shitty baserunner with at times a lack of baseball I.Q.

It's just a bad deal. No way around it, but hey.. thank god it's not 4 years and Reinsdorf's loyalty won out for him so good for Jose.

Edited by SoxAce

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1 minute ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:

Certainly seems like a slight overpay and totally has Jerry’s fingerprints all over it. I’m not too worried this is going to handcuff the Sox in 2 years though. 

Friggin Jerry Reinsdorf trying to guarantee himself another World Series game ball...bastard!!!

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6 minutes ago, ron883 said:

This deal is absolutely disastrous for the team. There is a high chance his last year is a complete sunken cost. This could be the difference between an ace and a low end starter. The difference between going to the world series and actually winning the damn thing. What a horrible, horrible deal. 

It would have been even worse for you had I been an asshole and accepted your ban bet, of Jose getting a deal longer than one year. 

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This and the Grandal news is all over the front page of MLB.com. Sox are winning the offseason again. Let's hope this time, it actually translates onto the field.

May be an overpay, but whatever, Jose earned it. This should not cripple them from signing other guys that will make this a winning clubhouse again.

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1 minute ago, BackDoorBreach said:

Grandal is arguably the most complete catcher in baseball.  Nothing about him is "Tier 2".

Again, temper the excitement on Grandal and probably kick up a notch on Abreu. This board has watched probably 5 total games of Grandal in the background from their couch in the past 5 years but everybody is an expert on a guy with a career ops under .800 and who couldn't secure a multi-year deal last year. He's a solid catcher. There aren't a lot of those in the league. We have one that is better than most. He's not Mike Trout. He's not Yelich. He's not even Posey or Mauer in their primes. He's a solid catcher though. aka, in my tier 2. 

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2 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

Not to mention is a terrible defensive 1B who has repeatedly said in the past that he does not want to DH full time (I can easily see Ricky playing him too much 1B with Vaughn down the road) and is a shitty baserunner with at times a lack of baseball I.Q.

It's just a bad deal. No way around it, but hey.. Reinsdorf's loyalty won out for him so good for Jose.

Jose will be asked to DH next season and he will do it. 

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26 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Sure, the whole roster configuration changes, but now we have $14M less to work with.

And one less position to worry about filling.

Look, I don't love the move (I preferred to go year by year), but I really don't think it's going to affect our ability to compete for a championship at all.

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1 minute ago, BrianAnderson said:

Again, temper the excitement on Grandal and probably kick up a notch on Abreu. This board has watched probably 5 total games of Grandal in the background from their couch in the past 5 years but everybody is an expert on a guy with a career ops under .800 and who couldn't secure a multi-year deal last year. He's a solid catcher. There aren't a lot of those in the league. We have one that is better than most. He's not Mike Trout. He's not Yelich. He's not even Posey or Mauer in their primes. He's a solid catcher though. aka, in my tier 2. 

I’m ok with you saying he’s not a tier 1 guy if Trout & Yelich are types of guys you are limited it to, but calling Grandal a “solid catcher” is absolute insanity, opinions be damned.  He is without question one of the best catchers in baseball full stop.

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22 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Hahn the cuck.  Hey you get this title of GM but you don't have 100% say on baseball ops you get the owner to hand out overpays, you still want the gig?  Sure.

Hahahaha.  Yeah.   Like any GM Is going to tell an owner to piss off if the owner wants a player signed.  Cmon man.  

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Do not love that third year.

1) Jose is a 1B only and a shitty one at that.

2) Jose is open about hating DHing.

3) Jose's OBP is slipping these past few years. Had a big increase in counting stats (HR/RBIs) with the 2019 baseballs but so did a lot of guys. If they switch back the balls it could be kind of ugly.

4) We have the #1 first base prospect in all of MLB who could reasonably be ready for big league play at the end of 2020.

Don't love it. Found it a bit unnecessary but of course am happy for Abreu and he certainly "deserves it" whether or not its the best move for the roster for 2020-2022.

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3 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

Jose will be asked to DH next season and he will do it. 

I'd feel a helluva lot better about this move if I could lock Jose in at DH for 130 games next year.  There's no reason for his bum ass to be playing 1B.

The Sox obviously want to help their young pitchers, hence the Grandal plan and how they had him evaluate how he could help before the signing.  So how about you get someone that isn't a statue at 1B?  Jose turns balls to his left into doubles and even triples that rattle around in the corner entirely too often.   A good 1B will save 10 runs next year over Jose.

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1 hour ago, Greg Hibbard said:

I would be very interested to hear what critics of this deal think Jose’s numbers need to be over this contract to justify it

roughly 6 WAR To break even and hopefully they don't shit the bed and give away a talent like Semien in the process because there aren't enough ABs.

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White Sox being loyal again. After further review, I change my mind on this one.  What better than to have a player stay with the same team for 9 years of his pro career.  The key is, lets hope he can continue to be Jose Abreu. If so, even better.  Remember, it went Frank Thomas, Paul Konerko, and now Jose Abreu as faces of this franchise. The next couple of years we will see who takes the baton as face of this franchise but for now its Jose Abreu. And no better man and person is fit for this job right now. Lets bring home a championship Jose!

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45 minutes ago, Lillian said:

With Robert, Moncada, Grandal and Jose, the Sox have the inside track on the Cuban pipeline. Maybe there will be more fellow countryman coming to the South Side, in the next few years. Perhaps that's one of the intangibles in this move. It's all part of the tradition started in the 50's, with Minnie Miñoso.

Unfortunately there's not much of a pipeline anymore. The Dodgers became much more involved with signing Cubans than the Sos were. Not sure if it's paying off for the Dodgers. The Sox  haven't really shown us they are that interested in signing anyone besides the big names like Abreu and Robert recently. Maybe they made an effort for the Gurriel brothers but I can't recall it. They just haven't used International free agency to it's full advantage.

It might mean something with a player like Grandal or other major leaguers but money is always the determining factor. Grandal was born in Havana, Cuba, where he  He emigrated to the United States with his mother, step-father, and maternal grandparents at age 10 "the easy way," through the lottery system.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasmani_Grandal

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I guess if Abreu regresses slightly and becomes a 23HR/80RBI guy with a .280/.315 slash, what would he get on the free market as a 1B DH?

Strangely enough there aren't many guys that compare well to Jose.

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1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

2 steps forward 1 back.  So fucking typical of this franchise.  Jesus Christ.  There is about a 50% chance you're paying a REPLACEMENT LEVEL DH 18 million in 2022.  FFS.

1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

There was zero fucking reason other than JR rewards loyalty, not performance.

 

So is it Hahn with a poor signing or JR rewarding loyalty. You could throw KW, Renteria and the bat boy in as well.

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3 minutes ago, raBBit said:

Do not love that third year.

1) Jose is a 1B only and a shitty one at that.

2) Jose is open about hating DHing.

3) Jose's OBP is slipping these past few years. Had a big increase in counting stats (HR/RBIs) with the 2019 baseballs but so did a lot of guys. If they switch back the balls it could be kind of ugly.

4) We have the #1 first base prospect in all of MLB who could reasonably be ready for big league play at the end of 2020.

Don't love it. Found it a bit unnecessary but of course am happy for Abreu and he certainly "deserves it" whether or not its the best move for the roster for 2020-2022.

Sums it up nicely. 

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Plus this is one of those moves that screams to other players, the White Sox will take care of you if you perform

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3 minutes ago, raBBit said:

Do not love that third year.

1) Jose is a 1B only and a shitty one at that.

2) Jose is open about hating DHing.

3) Jose's OBP is slipping these past few years. Had a big increase in counting stats (HR/RBIs) with the 2019 baseballs but so did a lot of guys. If they switch back the balls it could be kind of ugly.

4) We have the #1 first base prospect in all of MLB who could reasonably be ready for big league play at the end of 2020.

Don't love it. Found it a bit unnecessary but of course am happy for Abreu and he certainly "deserves it" whether or not its the best move for the roster for 2020-2022.

This is pretty much how I feel, except that Jose hating the DH should not matter. When Vaughn is ready, he'll be the 1B and Jose will DH.  It doesn't matter if he doesn't like it. There's no way that we would let Abreu play 1B when we have a better option in the middle of our championship run just because he hates being the DH.

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