White Sox 26th in overall MLB/MiLB talent 26 and below

[caulfield12]

https://sports.yahoo.com/mlb-26-and-under-power-rankings-evaluating-all-30-teams-by-the-young-talent-in-their-organizations-from-the-rockies-to-no-1-155931913.html

 

"If not for Luis Robert Jr. and Colson Montgomery, the White Sox would be dead last in our rankings. Those two in this organization are like that meme of a $2 million Bugatti in a raggedy driveway, though Andrew Vaughn probably doesn’t like that comparison.

...

Montgomery is considered one of the best 15 or so prospects in the sport, an immensely talented left-handed bat with advanced plate discipline. He’s also a shortstop in name only, and most experts believe a move to third is inevitable. He leads an otherwise iffy system that was bolstered somewhat by the additions of Edgar Quero, Nick Nastrini and Jake Eder during last summer’s sell-off. Still, the infrastructure of this organization is so far behind the times that industry experts encouraged a general “rounding down” on most White Sox prospects who journey up the system. New GM Chris Getz has a ton of work to do." — J.M.

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/mlb-26-and-under-power-rankings-nos-10-6-reds-young-hitters-dodgers-young-pitchers-among-baseballs-best-153447432.html

Still waiting #1-5, Orioles pretty obvious...Braves etc.

Edited March 21 by caulfield12

[Chimpton]

It's nothing we didn't already know, but seeing it in writing somehow makes it seem worse!

[Quin]

@chitownsportsfan, look at the disrespect towards Gene Watson

[The Mighty Mite]

26th in MLB, I’m shocked.

[Johno]

Doesn’t part of this fall on the shoulders of Chris Getz?  Was he not in charge of player development?   Very few if any of our first, second or third round picks developed at all with this organization, if anything, they got worse!!

[Snopek]

2 minutes ago, Johno said:

Doesn’t part of this fall on the shoulders of Chris Getz?  Was he not in charge of player development?   Very few if any of our first, second or third round picks developed at all with this organization, if anything, they got worse!!

Absolutely. And that's why you won't see him rising through the organizational ranks anytime soon. 

[WestEddy]

14 minutes ago, Johno said:

Doesn’t part of this fall on the shoulders of Chris Getz?  Was he not in charge of player development?   Very few if any of our first, second or third round picks developed at all with this organization, if anything, they got worse!!

I know it's easy to reflexively complain about player development during Getz's tenure (2017-2020), but putting fact to the assertion:

2017 - Burger, Sheets, Gonzalez

Burger was developed to a starting MLB 3B. I'd call that a success. Sheets is a major leaguer, playing out of position. His hitting has regressed since his debut. Luis Gonzalez got 11 PA's with the 2021 White Sox, and Hahn tried sneaking him through waivers the next year. The Giants grabbed him up and started him for a few months. While it may not be the case that Sheets can be considered "developed", he has had success in the bigs. 

2018 - Madrigal, Steele Walker, Pilkington

Madrigal was rushed by the GM, then traded for Craig Kimbrel. While Madrigal hasn't set the league on fire, he is still top 5 in bWAR for that year's first round, and has out-produced the 3 players picked in front of him. Walker was sent to Texas for Nomar Mazara, and Pilkington was sent to Cleveland for Cesar Hernandez during the 2021 pennant push. Developing players to the level that other teams want to trade for them is one method of obtaining MLB players. 

2019 - Vaughn, Thompson, Dahlquist

Jury's still out on Vaughn. He was rushed, then played out of position for a couple of years. That was the GM's decision, not Getz's. Matt Thompson was brought to AA, and is considered by many, here, to be a grave loss for this organization, thanks to Getz's personal development of this player. Dahlquist has never really progressed. 

2020 - Crochet, Kelly, Coffey

Garret Crochet is our opening day starter. I'm not sure what else you could say about this development success. Kelly and Coffey are both notable bullpen prospects. Coffey having looked good in the AFL, and Kelly moving up to AA. 

2021 - Monty, Kath, Burke

Colson Montgomery is a top 20 in the game prospect. Having been overlooked in the draft, Monty's development is one of this organization's best success stories. Wes Kath hasn't caught on at any level. Sean Burke has pitched his way up to AAA by the end of his 2nd pro season before getting injured. He is also a success story. 

2022 - Schultz, Pallette, Cannon

Noah Schultz is a consensus top 100 prospect who is being brought along slowly. Pallette came back from injury, and Cannon will most probably pitch at AAA in his 3rd pro season. 

Out of these 6 drafts that cover the entirety of Getz's time as director of player development, I would say only 2 of the 18 have been development failures. The others you might cite as not hitting their ceilings with the Sox were either traded, or rushed by the previous regime. Burger, Madrigal, Vaughn and Crochet are contributing major leaguers. Thompson, Kelly, Coffey, Montgomery, Burke, Schultz, Pallette and Cannon are well-regarded prospects. 

[Timmy U]

This is the opinion of two guys. They're very entertaining, but hardly the be all and end all of player development talk.  Sox have a long way to go, but the important thing is that they fix their ability to draft and develop players. This is merely a symptom. They fix the pipeline, the talent will take care of itself.

[fathom]

I just see way too many low ceilings in this organization besides Schultz

[baseball_gal_aly]

2 hours ago, fathom said:

I just see way too many low ceilings in this organization besides Schultz

I agree, but you think Montgomery has a low ceiling? 

[caulfield12]

2 minutes ago, baseball_gal_aly said:

I agree, but you think Montgomery has a low ceiling? 

Only if he can't stick at SS/3B.

Lower...not low.

[Texsox]

I thought there were 30 teams, what happened to the other four?

[baseball_gal_aly]

19 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Only if he can't stick at SS/3B.

Lower...not low.

If Monty can't stick at SS/3B he's a LH Andrew Vaughn 

[mac9001]

Honestly it's kind of a garbage write up. The Sox have actually built up some decent minor league pitching depth. If they have a couple more drafts to pad the depth they're likely to at least fill enough of the staff internally to free up a lot of potential money for a impact FA acquisition. The probably won't actually spend the money, but given they have fairly substantial financial flexibility that actually should work out in their favor for future value building.

[poppysox]

On 3/21/2024 at 4:27 PM, Timmy U said:

This is the opinion of two guys. They're very entertaining, but hardly the be all and end all of player development talk.  Sox have a long way to go, but the important thing is that they fix their ability to draft and develop players. This is merely a symptom. They fix the pipeline, the talent will take care of itself.

Same guys who picked us to win the division last year.  Let's just play the games.

[caulfield12]

40 minutes ago, mac9001 said:

Honestly it's kind of a garbage write up. The Sox have actually built up some decent minor league pitching depth. If they have a couple more drafts to pad the depth they're likely to at least fill enough of the staff internally to free up a lot of potential money for a impact FA acquisition. The probably won't actually spend the money, but given they have fairly substantial financial flexibility that actually should work out in their favor for future value building.

Except "unprecedented financial flexibility" last time ended up almost exclusively in the pockets of 30+ veterans.

[South Side Hit Men]

Chris Getz and team have a lot of catching up to do. I hate Cleveland.

MLB 26 and Under Power Rankings

1. 22 Baltimore 10 MLBH; 4 MLBP; 5 MiLH; 3 MiLP
2. 21 Atlanta 10 MLBH; 8 MLBP; 0 MiLH; 3 MiLP
3. 21 Seattle 8 MLBH; 10 MLBP; 2 MiLH; 1 MiLP
4. 20 Arizona 9 MLBH; 6 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 2 MiLP
5. 19 Cleveland 6 MLBH; 9 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 1 MiLP
6. 19 Cincinnati 8 MLBH; 7 MLBP; 1 MiLH; 3 MiLP
7. 18 Los Angeles N. L. 3 MLBH; 10 MLBP; 2 MiLH; 3 MiLP
8. 18 Milwaukee 7 MLBH; 4 MLBP; 4 MiLH; 3 MiLP
9. 17 San Diego 8 MLBH; 3 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 3 MiLP
10. 17 Detroit 5 MLBH; 4 MLBP; 4 MiLH; 4 MiLP
11. 16 Minnesota 6 MLBH; 5 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 2 MiLP
12. 16 Boston 7 MLBH; 4 MLBP; 4 MiLH; 1 MiLP
13. 16 Saint Louis 8 MLBH; 2 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 3 MiLP
14. 16 New York A. L. 9 MLBH; 1 MLBP; 2 MiLH; 4 MiLP
15. 16 Chicago N. L. 4 MLBH; 4 MLBP; 4 MiLH; 4 MiLP
16. 15 Tamps Bay 5 MLBH; 5 MLBP; 4 MiLH; 1 MiLP
17. 15 Texas 7 MLBH; 1 MLBP; 5 MiLH; 2 MiLP
18. 15 Pittsburgh 5 MLBH; 3 MLBP; 2 MiLH; 5 MiLP
19. 15 Washington 4 MLBH; 5 MLBP; 5 MiLH; 1 MiLP
20. 15 Kansas City 8 MLBH; 6 MLBP; 1 MiLH; 0 MiLP
21. 14 Miami 3 MLBH; 9 MLBP; 0 MiLH; 2 MiLP
22. 14 Toronto 7 MLBH; 2 MLBP; 2 MiLH; 3 MiLP
23. 13 Philadelphia 6 MLBH; 2 MLBP; 1 MiLH; 4 MiLP
24. 13 San Francisco 5 MLBH; 0 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 2 MiLP
25. 12 New York N. L. 5 MLBH; 1 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 3 MiLP
26. 12 Chicago A. L. 6 MLBH; 1 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 2 MiLP
27. 11 Houston 6 MLBH; 2 MLBP; 2 MiLH; 1 MiLP
28. 10 Los Angeles A. L. 5 MLBH; 4 MLBP; 1 MiLH; 0 MiLP
29. 10 Oakland 3 MLBH; 3 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 1 MiLP
30. 10 Colorado 5 MLBH; 0 MLBP; 3 MiLH; 2 MiLP

Links: 1-5 6-10 11-15 16-20 21-25  26-30

 

American League Central:

5. Cleveland Guardians (total score: 19)
Young MLB hitters (6/10): 2B Andres Gimenez, OF Steven Kwan, C Bo Naylor, SS Brayan Rocchio, OF Estevan Florial, INF Deyvison De Los Santos, INF/OF Tyler Freeman, INF Gabriel Arias, OF Will Brennan
Young MLB pitchers (9/10): RHP Triston McKenzie, RHP Emmanuel Clase, RHP Tanner Bibee, LHP Logan Allen, RHP Gavin Williams, RHP Xzavion Curry, RHP Hunter Gaddis
Prospect hitters (3/5): 1B Kyle Manzardo, OF Chase DeLauter, INF Juan Brito, OF George Valera, INF Jhonkensy Noel, INF Angel Martinez, INF Jose Tena
Prospect pitchers (1/5): RHP Cade Smith, LHP Joey Cantillo, RHP Tanner Burns, LHP Will Dion, RHP Franco Aleman

10. Detroit Tigers (total score: 17)
Young MLB hitters (5/10): OF Riley Greene, 1B Spencer Torkelson, OF Parker Meadows, OF Kerry Carpenter, OF Akil Baddoo
Young MLB pitchers (4/10): RHP Reese Olson, RHP Matt Manning, RHP Beau Brieske, LHP Joey Wentz
Prospect hitters (4/5): INF Jace Jung, 3B Justyn-Henry Malloy, C Dillon Dingler
Prospect pitchers (4/5): RHP Sawyer Gipson-Long, RHP Wilmer Flores, RHP Jackson Jobe, RHP Ty Madden, RHP Troy Melton

11. Minnesota Twins (total score: 16)
Young MLB hitters (6/10): 3B Royce Lewis, 2B Eduoard Julien, 1B Alex Kiriloff, OF Matt Wallner
Young MLB pitchers (5/10): RHP Jhoan Duran, RHP Louie Varland
Prospect hitters (3/5): INF Brooks Lee, INF/OF Austin Martin, OF Emmanuel Rodriguez
Prospect pitchers (2/5): RHP Simeon Woods Richardson, RHP Matt Canterino, RHP David Festa, RHP Marco Raya

20. Kansas City Royals (total score: 15)
Young MLB hitters (8/10): SS Bobby Witt Jr., 3B Maikel Garcia, 1B Vinnie Pasquantino, OF MJ Melendez, 2B Michael Massey, 1B Nick Pratto, OF Nelson Velazquez
Young MLB pitchers (6/10): LHP Cole Ragans, LHP Kris Bubic, RHP John McMillon
Prospect hitters (1/5): INF Nick Loftin, OF Tyler Gentry, 2B Peyton Wilson
Prospect pitchers (0/5): LHP Angel Zerpa, RHP Mason Barnett, LHP Anthony Veneziano

26. Chicago White Sox (total score: 12)
Young MLB hitters (6/10): OF Luis Robert Jr., 1B Andrew Vaughn, OF Dominic Fletcher
Young MLB pitchers (1/10): LHP Garrett Crochet, RHP Deivi Garcia
Prospect hitters (3/5): SS Colson Montgomery, C Edgar Quero, 3B Bryan Ramos
Prospect pitchers (2/5): RHP Nick Nastrini, RHP Jordan Leasure, LHP Jake Eder, RHP Prelander Berroa

[Balta1701]

4 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Same guys who picked us to win the division last year.  Let's just play the games.

Like you?

[mac9001]

4 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Except "unprecedented financial flexibility" last time ended up almost exclusively in the pockets of 30+ veterans.

The fact that they haven't been able to leverage financial flexibility into tangible assets doesn't mean it's still not valuable. The purpose on an exercise like this is to quantify value. Having money to spend is very valuable.

 

[poppysox]

10 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

Like you?

My point exactly.  They know exactly what we know.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

11 hours ago, mac9001 said:

Honestly it's kind of a garbage write up. The Sox have actually built up some decent minor league pitching depth. If they have a couple more drafts to pad the depth they're likely to at least fill enough of the staff internally to free up a lot of potential money for a impact FA acquisition. The probably won't actually spend the money, but given they have fairly substantial financial flexibility that actually should work out in their favor for future value building.

I'm very surprised I didn't see Thorpe in their write-up.

If you can't include the Minor League Pitcher of the year from last season as a top pitching prospect then I have to question the Sox rank.

He's definitely among those less than 2 years away which was their criteria. And they talked about the Cease trade in the Padres write-up. So unless they did the worse teams 1st before the Cease trade and the Padres after the Cease trade , they have no reason to exclude Thorpe.

Sox would have ranked higher than the Mets and tied with 2 other teams if their score was 1 higher. So theoretically they could be been ranked higher.

[caulfield12]

MLB in 2024: Win/Loss Predictions for All 30 Teams (newarena.com)

57-105 before the Cease trade...yikes.

[caulfield12]

 

White Sox ranked by The Athletic as having the 26th best Opening Day lineup

The White Sox offense is led by center fielder Luis Robert Jr., who hit 38 home runs last year with 20 stolen bases. They’re hoping that DH Eloy Jiménez can stay healthy and play a full season and that Andrew Vaughn will have a breakout campaign. Their defense up the middle is much better than last year but they sacrificed offense for that improvement.

https://theathletic.com/5355688/2024/03/22/mlb-lineup-ranking-braves-dodgers-rangers/?source=freeweeklyemail&campaign=602288&userId=310262

Marlins Nats Rockies A's finish worse.

Marlins have Anderson/Burger but lost Soler's 36 homers.

Nats will leap up standings with addition of James Wood in May.

#21/24/25 Tigers Royals Guardians.  Twins #12.

Edited March 24 by caulfield12

[nrockway]

20 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

 

White Sox ranked by The Athletic as having the 26th best Opening Day lineup

The White Sox offense is led by center fielder Luis Robert Jr., who hit 38 home runs last year with 20 stolen bases. They’re hoping that DH Eloy Jiménez can stay healthy and play a full season and that Andrew Vaughn will have a breakout campaign. Their defense up the middle is much better than last year but they sacrificed offense for that improvement.

https://theathletic.com/5355688/2024/03/22/mlb-lineup-ranking-braves-dodgers-rangers/?source=freeweeklyemail&campaign=602288&userId=310262

Marlins Nats Rockies A's finish worse.

Marlins have Anderson/Burger but lost Soler's 36 homers.

Nats will leap up standings with addition of James Wood in May.

#21/24/25 Tigers Royals Guardians.  Twins #12.

oh right, the incredible bats of Tim Anderson (.582 OPS) and Elvis Andrus (.662 OPS). oh yeah, Elvis is a free agent again by the way, I bet he's so lonesome he could cry (I don't think that was an Elvis song....whoa mama). I'm not exactly optimistic about this team, I just don't see any way it could be worse than it was last year.

Edited March 24 by nrockway

[WhiteSox2023]

5 hours ago, nrockway said:

oh right, the incredible bats of Tim Anderson (.582 OPS) and Elvis Andrus (.662 OPS). oh yeah, Elvis is a free agent again by the way, I bet he's so lonesome he could cry (I don't think that was an Elvis song....whoa mama). I'm not exactly optimistic about this team, I just don't see any way it could be worse than it was last year.

And they were replaced by the much more incredible bats of Paul DeJong (.612 OPS) and Nicky Lopez (.632 OPS)!  Add up the OPS’s of Anderson and Andrus and then DeJong and Lopez for a hilarious surprise.  They’ll play better defense but they won’t score any runs either.

Edited March 24 by WhiteSox2023