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There are some pros to calling up Robert right now as many have outlined. The three common themes: 1) Robert gets to see MLB pitching now - If that's the case can get challenged and become better served to prepare in the offseason for 2020. 2) Robert wouldn't have to forgo the first 15-20 games or whatever it is next April - Team is supposed to be compete 2020 and 162 > 145. He could be the difference between a game or two in April if they had to hold him down. 3) This team can grow together and "learn" how to win together. ------- To me, #1 is the biggest deal. Robert isn't matched in minor league baseball. He may struggle for a couple weeks now that he's had a few series in the IL or he may continue to dominate, either way, over the course of a full season this guy is going to light the league up. MLB pitching is a whole other world. His development would be best served if he's up here seeing how MLB pitchers attack him, learning to adjust and to gameplan and adjust again, getting a taste of the MLB regimen/process, etc. #2 is something that only can happen. If you hold him back and he tears an acl in spring training his clock has already started. If he has a nagging injury in ST and starts the year on the DL, his clock is already started. There is some risk on the front end to get an unguaranteed contribution on the back end. He can come up on Opening Day and start the year 5-60. He can also start in AAA and have the team come out blazing. Are they best served with him in the lineup? Definitely. But the return in a small sample is not worth the upside of attaining another year on contol. I would argue 162 games of Robert's play in 2025 is more valuable than 15-20 games of the (basically/probably) rookie Robert in 2018. #3 is nothing to me. The amount of turnover from the July 2019 roster to the May of 2020 roster will be tremendous. This team is going to have to learn to win together on the fly. You're going to have these guys as relative locks for 2020 Yoan Moncada Eloy Jimenez Lucas Giolito Tim Anderson Reynaldo Lopez Dylan Cease Aaron Bummer Alex Colome James McCann Leury Garcia Jace Fry That's 11 guys likely to be back on the roster next year without Abreu. That's assuming Bummer/Colome/Fry as well as Leury don't get traded in the next week. Yolmer/Cordell/Herrera/Covey/Marshall all have varying shots to be make the roster but not locks by any means. After looking at those pros, I still think we're better served holding him back until next year to get the extra service year even if that's not an acceptable opinion. It's not as simple as 7>6, but it's almost there. I'd like to hear more supporting the contrary though. In the end, the Sox have been pretty "by the book" on this stuff and we'll see how strong their hand is. I think this is going to be a PR nightmare that starts soon and carries on for at least 6 months.

Worst White Sox front office fanfiction ever.

Your 140 years of data is meaningless when exit velocities are believed to be at an all-time high now. Pretending that the risk now is equal to the risk in 1880 is disingenuous.

I don’t mean to get all conspiracy theory here but it literally sounded like a preemptive strike by Reinsdorf / Hahn to temper fans expectations for next offseason through Steve Stone. For Steve Stone to start calling out top free agent signings as not worth the money they receive seemed completely out of place for him and that the topic was intentionally discussed.

Buahahahah. You think the Sox are the only team we've infiltrated? You Fool!!! We have Statnik Squads stationed on every message board for every club in the MLB. We've infiltrated 90% of the minor leagues too! Thanks to the leadership of the WAR council, 5 years from now you won't even be able to visit a college team message board without seeing us convince the fan base that their favorite players suck now! We will continue to invent more and more ridiculous stats until no one even knows what team anyone plays for! and there is nothing, NOTHING, you can do to stop us!!!

Loyal fans are fans on the front of the jersey not the back of it. I have seen players that I have liked come and go. I don't however root for the players when they play against the sox. You on the other hand cheer home runs by opposing ex-white sox players when they hit them against the sox.

Not pointless. We are back in the race! http://www.tankathon.com/mlb

Well that was a pointless, boring, unproductive game. Oh well, 1 game closer to never having to see half this roster play again.

You pinned instead of closing. LOL

When you say his name three times, he jumps off his Colombian steed to relitigate the Tatis trade by comparing it to the Tony Pena/Chris Carter trade and how it relates to the 1996 season of the Toronto Blue Jays. ?

You know what I really want to see? The White Sox bring Cole and Boras in at the winter meetings, they make their usual presentation, run him through their team goals, the meetings with the manager, etc. Boras then says "ok, make us a contract offer". The White Sox hand Cole an offer sheet for 5/$75 million. Boras immediately turns around and hands the White Sox an already-prepared bill for the time he spent sitting in the room, and tells them they owe him for the time they just wasted as he walks out, leaving them dumbfounded.

The UA Game was very disappointing but these events usually are as the pitchers have such an unfair advantage. There were a few position players who were able to stand out despite the rash of strike outs (34 by my count). OF Zac Veen is long and loose with a smooth LH stroke and plus power potential. SS Warner Blakely oozes athleticism from his projectable 6'3" 185 frame. He has a chance for above avg raw. C Drew Romo is a switch hitter with excellent bat to ball skills and very good actions behind the plate. The power may not get to avg but the bat will still play. We already knew about PCA (0-2 2 punchies and a BB) and Dylan Crews (0-4 4 punchies) who both looked awful. A couple pitchers really stood out. LHP Nate Savino was 92-94 with a plus 75-76 curveball and excellent feel to pitch. RHP Victor Medieros was 92-94 SL 82-83 cb 78-80 ch 85. He threw all 4 pitches for strikes which was good to see because he was terrible at this event last year. Jared Jones 94-96 and Jared Kelly 94-97 were electric but we already knew that.

Nope, Abreu was not included. $50M is probably a tad high - perhaps closer to $45M if they non-tender Yolmer, but its in the ballpark. Point is, average MLB payroll is $135M. Sox could add Cole ($30M AAV), Grandal ($20M), Wood (8-10M AAV), Abreu ($8-10M AAV), and 2 relievers ($15M AAV) and still have a below average payroll. While obviously I'd love to see that happen, it won't. But the point is, at some point the Sox are going to add some serious payroll. My hope is that they do it by adding a few elite players, rather several over the hill meh veterans as they have done in the past. I am hopeful that they'll change their ways with a legit 5-7 year contention window ahead, but I understand those that say "I'll believe it when I see it".

ok, this thread has been cleaned up. I know we are very passionate about safety. Please be nice to each other.

I agree in that I don't think Stone said these things so he could get something off his chest. This is how Reinsdorf operates. Along with the stupid lecture of about building houses, I think you are right about the upcoming offseason. At the moment I expect little news from the White Sox before the 2020 season. If the young players develop quickly, the team has a chance for a .500 season. But I don't expect more than that, and I don't think big money is going to be spent.

I’m sure it was already posted here, but Hahn pretty much confirmed we won’t be seeing Robert until 2020.

I've posted this before, but I'll iterate it again... Jose's protection for his time in Chicago. Adam Dunn Conor Gillaspie Melky Cabrera Adam Laroche Matt Davidson Daniel Palka Avasail Garcia Todd Frazier Yonder Alonso Throw him in that Boston lineup and he'll be a monster. Throw him in a great lineup, and he'll be a monster. Today he had the best hitter on the team behind him, and look how he produced. Don't sleep on his bat in a great lineup. Boston would absolutely love someone like Abreu to plug in at first/DH

Of course. I'm expecting him to take longer than Jimenez to adjust. The fact that Jimenez didn't come in and rake immediately makes me think that Robert is going to be closer to Moncada than Eloy. It wouldn't shock me if Robert comes up and sucks. I actually expect that.

This is the last thread I am going to make for now. Simple poll. I answered Yes all 3 times. I love Jose's contributions but his leadership -- if necessary -- should be replaced by a veteran bench player, like an Ian Kinsler in a bench role, or something like that. We don't need to give him ABs any more. He shouldn't be the 1B or DH on the next Sox team that contends for a pennant IMO.

Weird how her family is advocating for nets and how her husband said if the dodgers raised the vertical netting, she wouldn't have been hurt. Nothing is relevant to you because you don't care about others getting hurt. Just say it, it's fine. Preventing people from getting hurt and dying isn't a bad thing, stop crying about looking through netting.

1st of all you don’t like Abreu. That is a so obvious from this entire thread. Really. You’d rather give Reed a shot, REED? so you’d send an all-star off for somebody’s low level prospects. This entire thread is total BS. I also want to be prepared for 2021, but I want to prepare for next week and next month. I want to prepare for tonight’s game. I say it over and over: I like it when the Sox win. Sox wins make me happy and Sox loses make me pissy. But when I read stuff like this on here, I think I am a minority. You guys would rather watch some low A level prospect improve his batting average from .247 to .253 than see the Sox have a winning home stand. I don’t begin to understand what motivates a thread like this. It’s easier for me to believe this thread was started by an Indian’s or Royal’s fan trying to undermine the Sox than a real White Sox fan. That this thread shows up the night after Abreu had an RBI double and a 2-run homer shows you have no sense of timing or Abreu’s value. One good thing is that I just read MLB.com’s list of top 20 trade rumors and, thankfully, No White Sox were mentioned, not Abreu or Colome. Thank goodness the Sox front office seems to like winning more than whatever alternative the guys agreeing with this thread seem to enjoy.

What would you call this strategy? Reverse trolling? And no surprise that you fall right into the trap of Greg’s reverse trolling. Also, is there a reason the Sox can’t trade Abreu to a contender for some talent and simply re-sign him in the offseason? Why is this an impossible task? I’m sorry to all of you who obsess over him but let’s be honest, Abreu isn’t the second coming of Mickey Mantle here. He’s an above average power hitting, albeit aging, 1B with a weak glove.

Not calling you out Tony because I agree but I keep seeing posts from some folks talking about his "lack" of power. My personal opinion is that if a guy hits .300 with some doubles, triples and get 175 hits or so a season AND plays his position well, I don't care if he "only" hits eight home runs. Sure the Sox need some power guys but after the past several seasons three or four 300 hitters in the lineup would be a very refreshing change.

Don’t be so negative. However if you can post negative comments I think others have a right to post positive comments about our team. Abreu needs to stay in a Chisox uniform and that’s that. Plus it doesn’t matter if any opponent is a good team or a bad team. A win is a win and hopefully we get more of them

I am shocked you are posting here. I figured you were signing up for Raystalk to worship Avi. If Abreu finds another team maybe you can worship him there as well.

yes the losing is penance for being bad fans. I sweat Greg are you sure you're not Ken Tremendous just pulling one of the ultimate long cons in the history of literature and culture? Like this is some deep undercover shit.

Yes. Just brings more fuel to the fire that the Sox won't pay for any FA. Just fucking invest that money into your scouting, analytics, and Player Development dept. If you want to be a small market team, be the A's or Rays, not the Pirates. If they don't do something reasonably acceptable to the fanbase this offseason, there are going to be torches and pitchforks at 35th and Shields. If the fanbase really gets pissed, the Sox could take off next year and the stadium could still be empty.

Did anyone hear Steve Stone discussing massive player contracts during tonight’s game? It sounded like he was speaking for Reinsdorf just now, saying that starting pitchers aren’t worth the massive contracts they receive to pitch into old age and because they are injury risks. Did anyone else hear this?

And he rips an oppo field double off him

There is zero reason we can’t go out and sign Bumgarner or Wheeler. They will get five years max (probably less with Wheeler) and that’s something we can easily do. We didn’t miss out on Machado because of the AAV, we missed out on him over the years.

Pretty simple, Hahn didn’t want to commit any long-term money or use any of his prospect currency just yet. Next offseason is a totally different story and to suggest an Ivan Nova caliber starter is the best they’ll do is hating just to hate. And by no means am I suggesting will acquire the right guy ultimately, but he sure as shit will commit significantly more resources than the $9M and lottery ticket Ivan Nova cost.

Bailey's numbers despite being in the DSL are incredible. In fact, his numbers are just as good as Robert (if not better) and he's a couple of years younger than he was at the time. I honestly feel he would be fine in Kannapolis next season. I think he's too advanced for the rookie league plus he won't start the season at a later time. But I can definitely see the Sox taking it slow with him cause of his age. I just don't see the sense personally.

We don't have any idea...the last time they spent significantly in free agency, it was Robertson/Cabrera/LaRoche/Bonifacio. That doesn't exactly instill confidence.

I disagree. You can get a near 6 ERA from starters a lot cheaper than Nova and his $9 million dollars (see Dylan Covey). Hahn thought Nova would do a good job as a #4/#5 in the rotation and then deal him away at the trade deadline.

I don’t see how you can shred a comment like this. Hahn brought in Nova, Santana, and Banuelos this past offseason as rotation guys. Did he intentionally waste $9 million on Nova thinking he would be bad? No, he thought he would be a good #4/#5 starter. He has brought in other such trash over the past few years (Paulino, Noesi, Latos, Santiago, Holland, MiGo) as rotation solutions. Did he intentionally sign the worst possible answers for his rotations? What big name starting pitchers has Hahn signed/acquired from outside the Sox organization? Big Game James nearing his retirement? Sure, Hahn will supposedly have more money to spend next offseason but does anyone trust him to spend it wisely? Why is there any reason to trust him going forward when it comes to free agency?

I heard his speech during the radio post game show while driving yesterday. Was it a great speech? Probably not because Harold is not a gifted speaker But it was incredibly sincere, emotional and heart warming. I am glad that I heard it. Harold Baines is a credit to baseball and an absolute gift to White Sox fans everyone. Congratulations Harold!!!

I know $ talks...but people assume that all free agents want to come to the Sox. Are we definitely sure of this? Wouldn’t shock me if some of the actual “big fish” don’t consider the Sox as a viable option. Won’t surprise me if the Sox have to overpay by a good margin if we want a top of the line starter in free agency

Re: bold, the point is that you don't have to add that anymore because they, ideally, rebuilt while knowing that their young, cheap core would be supplemented by non-garbage players. It isn't like the 2009-2016 go for it years because our young core has a lot more depth. Back then, it was always 4-6 players. For 2020 and beyond, it looks closer to a dozen.

Or maybe they didn't want to guarantee a guy $300M when they were about 2 years away from being ready for prime time. Having to overpay to land a premier FA may also be a legitimate possibility. But I also fully expect them to be in the Cole sweepstakes, and from the sounds of it, I am one of the few here who believe that.

The fact that this is true and they still didn't go the extra mile for Machado or Harper makes me think that maybe they're content raking in the cash and will only shop at the bargain bin or the dumpster. Maybe it might be that they have to severely overpay to land FA.

Not an inspiring list https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/minor-league?pos=all&lg=30&stats=bat&qual=y&type=0&team=&season=2006&seasonEnd=2019&org=&ind=0&splitTeam=true&players=&sort=14,1 Cortney Boran, Red Sox, DSL However, if you include all the way until 2005 with only players 16 and 17 and sort by wRC+, Bailey is 5th. Players like Candelario, Jorge Bonifacio, Julio Rodriguez, Estuiry Ruiz, Victor Robles and Estevan Florial show up in the top 25 of that list. His is much more BB driven, but Robles had a similar (but better) iso and worse walk percentage. So his performance does stand out.

I get where you're coming from, but like...Aaron Rowand would be a hall of famer by these standards.

I agree, but that's also not a high bar on the White Sox.

I love Harold Baines. He is not a HOF player. If he didn't wreck his knee, maybe. When he was mobile, he could really play RF like nobody's business.

Eloy doesn't have the talent of Robert. He has a much longer swing and slower hands too. The reason it took Moncada longer to adjust is because he has such an advanced approach. I think Robert will be much more aggressive at the plate, but won't have the same strike zone mastery as Moncada. To use a White Sox comparison, Moncada is more Thomas and Robert is more Belle. I think Eloy is somewhere in the middle, but he's not nearly as physically gifted as the other two. Robert and Moncada are physical specimens with tools across the board. Regardless, Robert's timetable for adjustment has absolutely nothing to do with Moncada or Eloy or any other player that's played MLB.

Great for the Padres man. Not sure what they have to do with the discussion at hand.

No, not true anymore. I just think it is an unrealistic assumption to think he's not going to struggle out of the gate. I thought Eloy would come up and just start raking but he didn't either. A half season of adjustments is reasonable for even the most polished minor league hitters. Idk what's negative about that.

No reason to post this Jack, we all know you’ll automatically expect the worst.

You realize development isn't linear right?