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Nick Madrigal

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4 minutes ago, Perfect Vision said:

That's a weird thing to throw in in the context of your post.

Subconsciously, seems to indicate that you think that because he's on the shorter side, he needs to be smarter than everyone else.  His height is a non-issue.  He made some mistakes, he recognized that, and will do better.

it means a guy who has overcome his anti-small bias in the game to become an elite prospect and top 5 pick is not a moron of a baseball player. It's very much at the core of the discussion. It's not subconscious, it's how the game and scouting work.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run

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7 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

And you weren't good enough for the pros still.. sad.

lol the pro's, i wasn't good enough to be below avg in an average conference. should have had me handing out gatorade.

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32 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Nick Madrigal is the dumbest "smart" baseball player I've ever watched. 

Madrigal has made more outs at third base in this short season than I did in 16 years of my life playing baseball. 

He's made more errors than I thought he'd make in a year. 

Nick has been awesome and will be great, but he has played absolutely idiotic baseball so far but I'll use the whacky season and him being amped for making the big leagues as the reason.

I hate to be that guy, but i wonder if his "baseball IQ" was overrated because he is a short, white, grindy player... His speed and defense as well. I'm not going to definitively say his baseball IQ is overrated after this small sample size, but i do wonder.

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Jesus christ, now we're shitting on a guy hitting .390 or whatever because he argued balls and strikes and was wrong to argue. Who gives a shit? No one would care if this was Abreu. The guy isn't a perfect player but at the plate he's been everything I've hoped and more. The team is 1 game in first with 17 to play. Shut the hell up already. Some of you just whine to whine.

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12 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

He's done 3 things this season that dumb players won't do in a year. He's done 3 things this year that some players will go their entire career without doing.

I think he is more aggressive than most players. I like that in a player and he will learn what he can and can't do.

The one I agree with was trying to take 3rd base when the ball was hit to the SS right in front of him. That's as bad a TA getting caught sleeping at 2B and getting picked off. That is something he can't do. I'll deal with the other ones as long as he shows he's learning.

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3 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

I hate to be that guy, but i wonder if his "baseball IQ" was overrated because he is a short, white, grindy player... His speed and defense as well. I'm not going to definitively say his baseball IQ is overrated after this small sample size, but i do wonder.

Pretty sure there isn't a speed bias for short white dudes

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You know who is a perfect complement to our team? Madrigal. We need a guy who isn't all home run or nothing. He is, and will be the mainstay at 2b for the next 10-12 years. mark that down for 2030.

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2 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said:

You know who is a perfect complement to our team? Madrigal. We need a guy who isn't all home run or nothing. He is, and will be the mainstay at 2b for the next 10-12 years. mark that down for 2030.

I agree with this. I love having a contact oriented player like Madrigal to compliment our plethora of high strikeout guys. If his defense will be as good as advertised, you have 3 above average fielders at the important infield positions. That is awesome.

Edited by Yearnin' for Yermin
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11 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

Jesus christ, now we're shitting on a guy hitting .390 or whatever because he argued balls and strikes and was wrong to argue. Who gives a shit? No one would care if this was Abreu. The guy isn't a perfect player but at the plate he's been everything I've hoped and more. The team is 1 game in first with 17 to play. Shut the hell up already. Some of you just whine to whine.

I know someone who would...

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He’s been better than I expected. He’s not getting the bat knocked out of his hands by big time fastballs. And yes, he’s the perfect 9th hitter on this team (especially once RF is upgraded).  I knew the base running and defense was overrated, but it’s not like he’s bad on defense. Also, I do think anyone hoping for 12-15 homers should see it’s not going to happen.  He has Juan Pierre type power, not Pedroia.

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17 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

Jesus christ, now we're shitting on a guy hitting .390 or whatever because he argued balls and strikes and was wrong to argue. Who gives a shit? No one would care if this was Abreu. The guy isn't a perfect player but at the plate he's been everything I've hoped and more. The team is 1 game in first with 17 to play. Shut the hell up already. Some of you just whine to whine.

Ding ding ding.

Let's be real, dude probably feels like he's had to earn his place on the diamond all his life. He might have the best bat-to-ball skills in the majors, but because people are expecting him to be a seasoned 5 year veteran, we're ripping a dude hitting .380.

If he hadn't missed a month, he'd probably be #3 in the ROY discussion based solely on his absurd batting average. To him, that might seem unfair so maybe internally he tries to stretch hits into doubles or triples to even it out. I don't know because I'm not a sports psychologist.

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7 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

I know someone who would...

Rightfully so. He made a boneheaded play jumping into the netting recently. Cost the Sox a base because he wanted to be a clown. He is a seasoned vet. He should get grilled for making stupid plays.

Edited by Yearnin' for Yermin
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I would like to see a thread named for every player  like this one devoted solely to Nick Madrigal. 

My opinion of Madrigal has evolved since I have seen him play in competitive games at the major league level. I like the fact that he tried pushing the envelope on the bases, that he runs out every grounder like it is a World Series game, and that he grinds out every at-bat hitting for a high average, even after two strikes.

I also changed my mind that he is a small player. He isn't  He has the upper body, arms and hands of a player that  is a half a foot taller and the heart of a giant.

When Nick runs the bases, his larger torso with small legs churning below remind me of the mascot races around the outfield. Seriously, Nick is a gamer and a great guy to have as  one of our Chicago White Sox for years to come.

 

Edited by tray
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27 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

nick

You might be right, but that first pitch is inside a little and not a strike but it's not egregious. He turned around after that strike three and complained. It's the second time I've seen him do that on an obvious strike. 

That 2-1 strike changed the AB, so maybe he was still b****ing about that. 

Thanks for making the image big enough where we can see it. It has to be a challenge for game-feed graphics to accommodate a players like Gaedel or Madrigal.

All kidding aside, @Perfect Vision, I agree size should not impact the discussion in terms of playing smart baseball. Hopefully he can add more muscle the next few years to allow increased power / prevent the ability for teams to squeeze him against major league pitching.

I believe he will be a quality MLB starter, with his elite contact ability, and good speed. He has played excellent being thrown into the deep end after a single minor league season, and his success this year has been a very pleasant surprise in a season of many. In some aspects, reminds me of Altuve when he came up. He has the ability to add significant stolen bases if the White Sox allows him to run and he works at it at the ML level. He won't hit .380 in his career, but a .300 + BA (and hopefully an increased walk rate as he gains experience) is very valuable.

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4 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Thanks for making the image big enough where we can see it. It has to be a challenge for game-feed graphics to accommodate a players like Gaedel or Madrigal.

All kidding aside, @Perfect Vision, I agree size should not impact the discussion in terms of playing smart baseball. Hopefully he can add more muscle the next few years to allow increased power / prevent the ability for teams to squeeze him against major league pitching.

I believe he will be a quality MLB starter, with his elite contact ability, and good speed. He has played excellent being thrown into the deep end after a single minor league season, and his success this year has been a very pleasant surprise in a season of many. In some aspects, reminds me of Altuve when he came up. He has the ability to add significant stolen bases if the White Sox allows him to run and he works at it at the ML level. He won't hit .380 in his career, but a .300 + BA (and hopefully an increased walk rate as he gains experience) is very valuable.

He's not going to hit .380, but I don't think .330-.345 for the majority of his prime is out of the question. I'd be surprised if he ever gets to double digits in HR in a season. He might max out at 6-8, with most seasons in the 3-5 range. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
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2 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

He's not going to hit .380, but I don't think .330-.345 for the majority of his prime is out of the question. I'd be surprised if he ever gets to double digits in HR in a season. He might max out at 6-8, with most seasons in the 3-5 range. 

If he hits 5 HRs that would be great.. He will never be a high OPS guy and that's fine.. He can be super productive while having low OPS.. Mazara type guys cannot for reference

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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Nick Madrigal is the dumbest "smart" baseball player I've ever watched. 

Madrigal has made more outs at third base in this short season than I did in 16 years of my life playing baseball. 

He's made more errors than I thought he'd make in a year. 

Nick has been awesome and will be great, but he has played absolutely idiotic baseball so far but I'll use the whacky season and him being amped for making the big leagues as the reason.

I'll take dumbest takes of the year for $2,000 Alex

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5 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

He's not going to hit .380, but I don't think .330-.345 for the majority of his prime is out of the question. I'd be surprised if he ever gets to double digits in HR in a season. He might max out at 6-8, with most seasons in the 3-5 range. 

The doubles rate will be more important than HRs for Nick. The ability to hit gaps and make OFers play deeper, to allow his line drives over the infield to drop. His speed will help stretch 1Bs to 2Bs, and hitting the gaps 2Bs to 3Bs.

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5 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

The doubles rate will be more important than HRs for Nick. The ability to hit gaps and make OFers play deeper, to allow his line drives over the infield to drop. His speed will help stretch 1Bs to 2Bs, and hitting the gaps 2Bs to 3Bs.

Yup 2B and 3B are the most important for him. He needs to hit 25+ 2B and 4+ 3B/162. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
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The strike three call was a strike, but I think he was arguing about the at-bat in general.  I don't have a problem with him arguing here and there.  Every player will do it.  He made a few base running mistakes the game before, and he took responsibility for them without using the phrase "rookie mistake".  The guy hits, rarely strikes out, and has shown to perform under pressure (2 strikes).  He's better than I expected, and probably better than most expected.  If we're spending pages b****ing about him arguing an at-bat, we're really digging to have something to b**** about.

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1 hour ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

I hate to be that guy, but i wonder if his "baseball IQ" was overrated because he is a short, white, grindy player... His speed and defense as well. I'm not going to definitively say his baseball IQ is overrated after this small sample size, but i do wonder.

Nah.  You can see he understands the game.  I think he is still in a stage where he is trying to impress people and make an impression on fans.  I don't think it is because he isn't a smart baseball player.  He just needs to understand he can't take advantage of MLB players the way he did NCAA ones.  I think he could have learned some of those lessons in the minors if he had more ABs and situations to learn them in.  He FLEW through the minors.  He will figure it out quickly.

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1 hour ago, soxfan49 said:

Jesus christ, now we're shitting on a guy hitting .390 or whatever because he argued balls and strikes and was wrong to argue. Who gives a shit? No one would care if this was Abreu. The guy isn't a perfect player but at the plate he's been everything I've hoped and more. The team is 1 game in first with 17 to play. Shut the hell up already. Some of you just whine to whine.

Who is shitting on him? He's been great, and I don't think these issues will continue but if they did that would be a major problem.

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