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White Sox Listening on Sale

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I'm not concerned at all that nothing has happened yet on our big-chips (Sale, Q) or on our mid-sized chips (Robertson, Melky, Frazier). With Sale and Q, the combination of ability and value (salary and control) and in an area of overall market weakness (quality SP) makes them highly valuable. No way is our Front Office not aware of this. All of the talk about the Sox "asking for the moon" and so forth is (a) justified (at this time in the trading spectrum), and (b) posturing from rival GMs who are trying to pressure a team in clear need to unload their prime assets at a more buyer friendly price. The Sox can only counter by sticking to their guns (at least now), playing teams and rivalries against each other, and ramping up the sense of impending doom to the competing claimants by using the expiring clock to their advantage. IF a Sale or Q deal was to be made during this year's trade deadline, I always expected it to be made at the 11th hour.

 

In other words, business as usual, folks.

 

Personally, I think our offensive suckitude is so strong (both our existing crew and our demonstrated inability to draft and/or develop offensive talent) that we truly need to restock. I'd love to see one of Sale or Q go for an offense oriented haul (a top arm or two coming back as well) while the other goes to the Dodgers for a deal headlined by Urias, but also bringing back DeLeon, Pederson, and a few more sticks. I'd also rather see Sale out of the A.L. altogether -- so Sale to LA for me.

 

Between possible Bosox and Texas hauls -- Bosox all the way. Especially if Texas won't trade Mazara (at least during the season), most of the other headliners are riddled with questions. Not so with the Red Sox. The prospect business is risky enough. We need greater certainty with our uncertainty.

 

I also think there are two major sleepers out there -- the Yankees and the Pirates. Real good chance the Yanks have assembled prospects for Chapman and Miller in order to be players for Sale or Q. With Torres, Frazier, and Sheffield now under their control, they can easily send back the proverbial haul -- give me those three, plus Sanchez and another arm and they are easily in the mix. In fact, expand that deal and let them have homecoming for lots of wayward Yankmes -- how about Q, Robertson, and Melky in a mega-deal? LOVE fueling the Red Sox - Yankees rivalry to our possible advantage. My other sleeper is the Pirates. Sure, looks like they've cashed it in for 2016. That said, they have a strong nucleus for the foreseeable future, a solid prospect base, and an absolute NEED for cost-controlled pitching super talent. No way can they take the leap to a next level -- or even sustain this level -- without that. I'd be very surprised if they're not heavily in the mix right now, particularly because they could trade rostered MLB talent today while those still competing likely feel they can't.

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QUOTE (CyAcosta41 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 07:25 AM)
I'm not concerned at all that nothing has happened yet on our big-chips (Sale, Q) or on our mid-sized chips (Robertson, Melky, Frazier). With Sale and Q, the combination of ability and value (salary and control) and in an area of overall market weakness (quality SP) makes them highly valuable. No way is our Front Office not aware of this. All of the talk about the Sox "asking for the moon" and so forth is (a) justified (at this time in the trading spectrum), and (b) posturing from rival GMs who are trying to pressure a team in clear need to unload their prime assets at a more buyer friendly price. The Sox can only counter by sticking to their guns (at least now), playing teams and rivalries against each other, and ramping up the sense of impending doom to the competing claimants by using the expiring clock to their advantage. IF a Sale or Q deal was to be made during this year's trade deadline, I always expected it to be made at the 11th hour.

 

In other words, business as usual, folks.

 

Personally, I think our offensive suckitude is so strong (both our existing crew and our demonstrated inability to draft and/or develop offensive talent) that we truly need to restock. I'd love to see one of Sale or Q go for an offense oriented haul (a top arm or two coming back as well) while the other goes to the Dodgers for a deal headlined by Urias, but also bringing back DeLeon, Pederson, and a few more sticks. I'd also rather see Sale out of the A.L. altogether -- so Sale to LA for me.

 

Between possible Bosox and Texas hauls -- Bosox all the way. Especially if Texas won't trade Mazara (at least during the season), most of the other headliners are riddled with questions. Not so with the Red Sox. The prospect business is risky enough. We need greater certainty with our uncertainty.

 

I also think there are two major sleepers out there -- the Yankees and the Pirates. Real good chance the Yanks have assembled prospects for Chapman and Miller in order to be players for Sale or Q. With Torres, Frazier, and Sheffield now under their control, they can easily send back the proverbial haul -- give me those three, plus Sanchez and another arm and they are easily in the mix. In fact, expand that deal and let them have homecoming for lots of wayward Yankmes -- how about Q, Robertson, and Melky in a mega-deal? LOVE fueling the Red Sox - Yankees rivalry to our possible advantage. My other sleeper is the Pirates. Sure, looks like they've cashed it in for 2016. That said, they have a strong nucleus for the foreseeable future, a solid prospect base, and an absolute NEED for cost-controlled pitching super talent. No way can they take the leap to a next level -- or even sustain this level -- without that. I'd be very surprised if they're not heavily in the mix right now, particularly because they could trade rostered MLB talent today while those still competing likely feel they can't.

 

Can you imagine Sale and Kershaw paired together?

(Of course, they already had Greinke, who wasn't too shabby.)

 

I think Puig coming back is likelier than Pederson, fwiw.

 

Agree about the abysmal offense. Even with Lawrie, who just strikes out way too much to enjoy.

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QUOTE (SCCWS @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 07:29 AM)
Huh???t. Boston is short a LF right now w Young out and Holt still recovering. Why would they trade their LF heir apparent and their CF and replace w Melky when they are in the pennant chase.

 

Why? Because they're getting a corner outfielder in the deal. And, more importantly, because they're going to have to give up big-time talent when they trade for three years of a perennial Cy Young candidate with a ridiculous bargain contract. Especially when they're taking their best prospect off the table.

 

Now they have no CF. As I posted before, Bradley is an untouchable. Betts maybe in the offseason but he will require a lot in return removing a lot of prospects from a Sale or Q haul.

 

Wrong, Betts played 133 games in CF last season.

 

Sorry, but if Bradley (or Betts) and Moncada are untouchable, Sale isn't going to Boston.

 

Edited by Black_Jack29

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QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 07:59 AM)
LAD is 1 w/ win now mandate & resources for a chris sale trade. of course, no 1 this valuable's ever been dealt at deadline

https://twitter.com/JonHeyman/status/760112583160520705

 

David Price last year?

 

Although not the age (27) and with remaining years of bargain-basement control involved.

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QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 08:32 AM)
Can you imagine Sale and Kershaw paired together?

(Of course, they already had Greinke, who wasn't too shabby.)

 

I think Puig coming back is likelier than Pederson, fwiw.

 

Agree about the abysmal offense. Even with Lawrie, who just strikes out way too much to enjoy.

 

Doesnt look likely. At least not this year, Kershaws back is f***ed

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QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 08:07 AM)
Doesnt look likely. At least not this year, Kershaws back is f***ed

 

Well, yeah, the whole back thing.

 

Jenks and Crede know all about that...at any rate, just adding more YOUNG pitching doesn't cure any line-up problems unless we keep leveraging young pitching in these two or three for one type deals.

 

We need to get Pederson (obviously they'll look to deal Puig first)...and two more position prospects back, along with the oft-mentioned pitching names such as Urias and De Leon.

 

Their offense is so ragged, with Seager and Turner being the two best hitters...surely they could use Melky or Frazier. For example, they could move Turner to 2B, or LF. Or play Frazier at 1B, although not sure they're 100% ready to give up on Adrian Gonzalez this year.

 

Robertson might come into play too, with their closer leaving for FA after this year.

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QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 10:07 AM)
David Price last year?

 

Although not the age (27) and with remaining years of bargain-basement control involved.

 

Nope.

 

Sale's trade value this year dwarf's Price's last year.

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QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 10:32 PM)
It's not half assed if you believe it's the best value you're going to get even if it's not 100 percent everything you hoped for. And you can't kill something that's already dead and this franchise has been dead for a long while now.

 

If you aren't getting a huge return for Sale and/or Q, you aren't making yourself better.

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QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 10:36 PM)
As opposed to last offseason's "half-assed", so-called "upgrade" moves of signing Rollins, Jackson, Navarro, Avila, and Latos that you labeled at the time as "surreal"?

 

Are you really and honestly trying to compare those guys to Chris Sale and Jose Quintana? We are talking about a mass of one year signings to the two best contracts in all of baseball. You are just trolling now..

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whitesoxdave ‏@barstoolWSD 3m3 minutes ago Chicago, IL

Just texted my guy. "It's crazy how quiet it's been... I got nothing"

 

 

Life is awesome being a White Sox fan, said nobody

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QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 10:43 PM)
Or trading them in their last seasons and getting one of these type of prospects instead of 3 or 4.

 

Again, there are no indications that we have gotten that offer. In fact, the indiciations are that we are getting a package of middle of the road prospects, and not top ones.

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QUOTE (GoGoSox2k2 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:20 AM)
whitesoxdave ‏@barstoolWSD 3m3 minutes ago Chicago, IL

Just texted my guy. "It's crazy how quiet it's been... I got nothing"

 

 

Life is awesome being a White Sox fan, said nobody

 

Maybe his contact just isn't leaking him info today.

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Soxtalk: SALE SHOULD BRING BACK EVERY TEAM'S TOP TEN PROSPECTS, EVEN IF THEY'RE ALL THE BEST IN THE GAME! DON'T WANNA PAY UP? TOUGH! YOU DON'T GET SALE THEN!

 

*all reports indicate teams are interested but balking at Sox' high asking prices, deadline passes with no trade of Sale*

 

Soxtalk: HAHN IS AN ABSOLUTE FAILURE FOR NOT TRADING SALE! THIS TEAM HAS NO CHANCE TO WIN EVER AGAIN AND NEEDS TO TRADE EVERYONE WHILE THEY STILL HAVE VALUE!

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QUOTE (GoGoSox2k2 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:20 AM)
whitesoxdave ‏@barstoolWSD 3m3 minutes ago Chicago, IL

Just texted my guy. "It's crazy how quiet it's been... I got nothing"

 

 

Life is awesome being a White Sox fan, said nobody

 

His source probably realized he should stop leaking info to this guy.

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QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:27 AM)
Soxtalk: SALE SHOULD BRING BACK EVERY TEAM'S TOP TEN PROSPECTS, EVEN IF THEY'RE ALL THE BEST IN THE GAME! DON'T WANNA PAY UP? TOUGH! YOU DON'T GET SALE THEN!

 

*all reports indicate teams are interested but balking at Sox' high asking prices, deadline passes with no trade of Sale*

 

Soxtalk: HAHN IS AN ABSOLUTE FAILURE FOR NOT TRADING SALE! THIS TEAM HAS NO CHANCE TO WIN EVER AGAIN AND NEEDS TO TRADE EVERYONE WHILE THEY STILL HAVE VALUE!

 

If the reports are true and the best prospect in this package is someone ranked where Avi Garcia was ranked when we got him, you laugh and keep Chris Sale. Period.

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:20 AM)
Again, there are no indications that we have gotten that offer. In fact, the indiciations are that we are getting a package of middle of the road prospects, and not top ones.

It would be pretty much an unprecedented trade. Teams trade their ace once in a while. But none that are pitching on a team friendly contract that has 3 more seasons to go. I really wonder if anyone knows how to price it, and the problem is he is still one guy who plays once every 5 days. Do you decimate your system on one guy who still can get hurt etc. or do you move on to a lesser guy with a far lower price tag?

 

I think it's a really complicated thing. For the White Sox, it has to be a no brainer. For the other team, who all would love to have him, can they really justify the cost?

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Bob Nightengale ‏@BNightengale 2m2 minutes ago

The Boston #RedSox had late-night talks with the #WhiteSox about Chris Sale. If Sale is moved, #RedSox and #Dodgers are likely destinations.

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QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 07:27 AM)
Soxtalk: SALE SHOULD BRING BACK EVERY TEAM'S TOP TEN PROSPECTS, EVEN IF THEY'RE ALL THE BEST IN THE GAME! DON'T WANNA PAY UP? TOUGH! YOU DON'T GET SALE THEN!

 

*all reports indicate teams are interested but balking at Sox' high asking prices, deadline passes with no trade of Sale*

 

Soxtalk: HAHN IS AN ABSOLUTE FAILURE FOR NOT TRADING SALE! THIS TEAM HAS NO CHANCE TO WIN EVER AGAIN AND NEEDS TO TRADE EVERYONE WHILE THEY STILL HAVE VALUE!

I understand the point you are making, but this really is not what many of us are saying.

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QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:30 AM)
Bob Nightengale ‏@BNightengale 2m2 minutes ago

The Boston #RedSox had late-night talks with the #WhiteSox about Chris Sale. If Sale is moved, #RedSox and #Dodgers are likely destinations.

 

Good. Preferable prospects to what Texas has.

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QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 10:30 AM)
Bob Nightengale ‏@BNightengale 2m2 minutes ago

The Boston #RedSox had late-night talks with the #WhiteSox about Chris Sale. If Sale is moved, #RedSox and #Dodgers are likely destinations.

 

Sale to one, Q to another.

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QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:30 AM)
Bob Nightengale ‏@BNightengale 2m2 minutes ago

The Boston #RedSox had late-night talks with the #WhiteSox about Chris Sale. If Sale is moved, #RedSox and #Dodgers are likely destinations.

 

Come oooooon, Dave. Come ooooooon.

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QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:31 AM)
I understand the point you are making, but this really is not what many of us are saying.

 

But you can bet your ass that if the package ends up mediocre because the Sox didn't exercise enough patience, those fans will be throwing a fit about wasting their best asset.

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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:29 AM)
It would be pretty much an unprecedented trade. Teams trade their ace once in a while. But none that are pitching on a team friendly contract that has 3 more seasons to go. I really wonder if anyone knows how to price it, and the problem is he is still one guy who plays once every 5 days. Do you decimate your system on one guy who still can get hurt etc. or do you move on to a lesser guy with a far lower price tag?

 

I think it's a really complicated thing. For the White Sox, it has to be a no brainer. For the other team, who all would love to have him, can they really justify the cost?

 

This is something I've been trying to figure out personally. How do you account for the risk the other team faces by each additional prospect and quality of prospect, as you trade for a single player.

 

I still think we are in favorable conditions, as there are 4-5 teams with mature rosters that have young position players, with more young help on the way. They can do as the Dodgers have done and keep relying on youngsters to perform right away, or you finally say, we are close and get those last pieces.

 

Unfortunately for sox 2 of those teams (Cleveland/Cubs) were not partners you would do business with.

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