GreenSox Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 5 hours ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: I don’t think the round they were drafted in is relevant. Either guy could be a mid-rotation type. Six years of control is really valuable. If we're willing to take a mid-rotation guy as centerpiece, our asking price isn't as outrageous as advertised. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 (edited) 11 minutes ago, GreenSox said: If we're willing to take a mid-rotation guy as centerpiece, our asking price isn't as outrageous as advertised. I think your expectations may be too high then. The Sox are trading 2 years of control of what some people don’t think is an ace. I think it’s fair to at least call Cease a very good #2 starter right now with ace potential. If the Sox get 6 years of a #3 starter back for 2 years of a #2 starter, how much more talent should the Sox get back along with that starter? Guys like Woo and Miller are now considered to be proven mid rotation MLB starters. If you want a large return, you would have to forego these guys and go for an all prospect return. Edited January 29 by WhiteSox2023 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 5 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said: Buehrle was a 38th round pick. And Grizzly Adams had a beard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 6 minutes ago, ron883 said: And Grizzly Adams had a beard What was Piazza, some round in the 50's, right? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxBlanco Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 24 minutes ago, ron883 said: And Grizzly Adams had a beard Grizzly Adams DID have a beard! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkokieSox Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said: I think your expectations may be too high then. The Sox are trading 2 years of control of what some people don’t think is an ace. I think it’s fair to at least call Cease a very good #2 starter right now with ace potential. If the Sox get 6 years of a #3 starter back for 2 years of a #2 starter, how much more talent should the Sox get back along with that starter? Guys like Woo and Miller are now considered to be proven mid rotation MLB starters. If you want a large return, you would have to forego these guys and go for an all prospect return. There’s a far cry from a known #2 with 2 years control and hopefully, maybe #3 with 6 years of control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said: I think your expectations may be too high then. The Sox are trading 2 years of control of what some people don’t think is an ace. I think it’s fair to at least call Cease a very good #2 starter right now with ace potential. If the Sox get 6 years of a #3 starter back for 2 years of a #2 starter, how much more talent should the Sox get back along with that starter? Guys like Woo and Miller are now considered to be proven mid rotation MLB starters. If you want a large return, you would have to forego these guys and go for an all prospect return. While it may be a fair return, my point was simply that it doesn't reach the "sky high" or "outrageous" level that the media reports have characterized Getz' demands. And my preference would be to not accept that Mariners return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeC Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 2 hours ago, ChiliIrishHammock24 said: I'm willing to overlook a .230 batting average when his elite walk rate still gives him a .330+ OBP, game breaking speed, above average power, and CF defense. He's ranked among their top prospects for a reason, and that's all despite his swing and miss. And again, I'm taking about him as a 3rd piece in a trade that includes Bryce Miller and someone else in between. In other orgs, yes. In this org, he ends up with a .150 average to round out a nice .280 OBP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy U Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 2 hours ago, caulfield12 said: What was Piazza, some round in the 50's, right? True, but his ‘roids were 1st rounders. Top notch quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pale Sox Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 7 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said: Buehrle was a 38th round pick. Draft & follow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 6 hours ago, baseball_gal_aly said: His value is whatever other teams are willing to offer, not what Getz or this board wants in return. Well there is an absolute value to running Cease out there for 33 starts, half of which will be quality starts, and 75% of which will be 50+ GameScore starts. We don't have to trade Cease. I think the hold-up has more to do with the Boras clients than Getz's "high ask". The Yankees and Orioles (or others) haven't pivoted to other equal or better options for returns that expose Getz as mean and greedy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 So we're nearing Feb. 1. After that it's just hours before pitchers and catchers report. OK a few days. But my point is, quietly the offseason is about over. The Sox did absolutely nothing to improve the team. So my question to you is, "What's going on?" This is almost unprecedented. The Sox usually do something in the offseason. All of a sudden it's assumed Sox are flat out of cash and have no room to acquire anybody. Weird way to sell tix if they care at all about that. Good luck to the TV contract people. Who is going to watch this product this year? Not me. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 6 hours ago, WestEddy said: Well there is an absolute value to running Cease out there for 33 starts, half of which will be quality starts, and 75% of which will be 50+ GameScore starts. We don't have to trade Cease. I think the hold-up has more to do with the Boras clients than Getz's "high ask". The Yankees and Orioles (or others) haven't pivoted to other equal or better options for returns that expose Getz as mean and greedy. If Cease is with Sox throughout 2024, I doubt he gets 33 starts. Boros won't allow it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 8 minutes ago, oldsox said: If Cease is with Sox throughout 2024, I doubt he gets 33 starts. Boros won't allow it. Nor will Soros at Davos. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 2 hours ago, oldsox said: If Cease is with Sox throughout 2024, I doubt he gets 33 starts. Boros won't allow it. Boras has no control over this, unless he tells Cease to fake an injury. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 2 hours ago, oldsox said: If Cease is with Sox throughout 2024, I doubt he gets 33 starts. Boros won't allow it. That's not how that works. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 9 hours ago, greg775 said: So we're nearing Feb. 1. After that it's just hours before pitchers and catchers report. OK a few days. But my point is, quietly the offseason is about over. The Sox did absolutely nothing to improve the team. So my question to you is, "What's going on?" This is almost unprecedented. The Sox usually do something in the offseason. All of a sudden it's assumed Sox are flat out of cash and have no room to acquire anybody. Weird way to sell tix if they care at all about that. Good luck to the TV contract people. Who is going to watch this product this year? Not me. There has been some marginal improvement, but likely not enough to get more than 70 wins. If Getz is ambitious and has another $10M - $15M at his disposal, he could add a legitimate RF, another SP lotto ticket, a couple relievers and possibly a legitimate starting 2B. I’m hoping for a RF at this point and keeping Cease beyond receiving a crazy good offer. Wish I could have found a sportsbook I could bet Sox over 62 1/2 wins in Vegas. The best I found for Illinois is 64 1/2, which isn’t a safe enough margin IMO, especially with Cease uncertainty and likely trade deadline deals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 34 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said: There has been some marginal improvement, but likely not enough to get more than 70 wins. If Getz is ambitious and has another $10M - $15M at his disposal, he could add a legitimate RF, another SP lotto ticket, a couple relievers and possibly a legitimate starting 2B. I’m hoping for a RF at this point and keeping Cease beyond receiving a crazy good offer. Wish I could have found a sportsbook I could bet Sox over 62 1/2 wins in Vegas. The best I found for Illinois is 64 1/2, which isn’t a safe enough margin IMO, especially with Cease uncertainty and likely trade deadline deals. I think any additional addition via FA will come with Cease being traded with his salary going towards whoever is added. This year seems twofold to me: 1) Getz is clearly trying to reshape this team to be something different. Will his vision be successful? Not this year, but once you jettison Eloy and Moncada’s deals, you are looking at a super low payroll for 2025 that should give him flexibility to add actual impact FA. 2) Obviously payroll is slashed from the last few years, so they probably have it at a point that they can recoup their financial losses with the massive drop in attendance. We all know how Jerry operates, so it is what it is. Im not expecting much for this upcoming season. With the way the draft pick falls outside of the top 10, it’s kind of pointless to root for losses. I just want to see better fundamental play and see some success from anyone who will be around 2025 and beyond. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 I smell a rat named Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 Something like Woo + Montes + Clase doable? Montes is pretty intriguing. I feel like the Sox would prefer an OF closer to the majors. Gabriel Gonzaelez just feels like more of what we have so I'd prefer he not be a major part of the trade. I would certainly take him over Clase in the proposed deal, but that feels pretty heavy with the Woo headliner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 24 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Something like Woo + Montes + Clase doable? Montes is pretty intriguing. I feel like the Sox would prefer an OF closer to the majors. Gabriel Gonzaelez just feels like more of what we have so I'd prefer he not be a major part of the trade. I would certainly take him over Clase in the proposed deal, but that feels pretty heavy with the Woo headliner. I no longer can resist using the MASH TV series pun. It would be fun to watch pitching Woo. I apologize if someone has already done it. 😁 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 43 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Something like Woo + Montes + Clase doable? Montes is pretty intriguing. I feel like the Sox would prefer an OF closer to the majors. Gabriel Gonzaelez just feels like more of what we have so I'd prefer he not be a major part of the trade. I would certainly take him over Clase in the proposed deal, but that feels pretty heavy with the Woo headliner. Seems sooo light. I hate the idea of a Woo/Miller headliner. I'd much prefer to accept a Kjerstad and Ortiz/Norby deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 23 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: Seems sooo light. I hate the idea of a Woo/Miller headliner. I'd much prefer to accept a Kjerstad and Ortiz/Norby deal. I prefer the O's packages too. I feel like Woo is pretty valuable though, and Montes is around 50 on BA's top 100. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaseballNick Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 22 hours ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said: Woo's savant page is a thing of beauty: https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/bryan-woo-693433?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb Consider me Woo(ed). He’s got a great arm. There’s a lot to like about him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeC Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 2 minutes ago, BaseballNick said: Consider me Woo(ed). He’s got a great arm. There’s a lot to like about him. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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