Leaderboard

I'd like to take this opportunity on Thanksgiving to thank all of Soxtalk for giving me a forum to write about my favorite team. I know this place can get wild and crazy a lot and I mean a REAL lot but I wouldn't be coming here for the last 15+ years if I didn't love this place. Thank you all from the bottom of my heart and have a great Thanksgiving ! Now let's continue the craziness and get some reinforcements and win a World Series !

it's sad the Sox could literally plug every hole without trading away a single player, but they would rather pinch pennies this has been the Sox M.O. since I started watching this team I might not be in agreement with everyone with my next comment but imo the Sox are closer to a world series by keeping the farm intact and landing some top tier FAs than trading for guys who aren't valued by their team anymore and signing some lower tier guys

I'm breaking 15 years of lurking status on this site to agree with this thread. Glad to sanity start to break into the hypothetical trade talks.

All you have to do is google "church COVID deaths" to disprove this bullshit. This is absolutely a problem not that you would actually do research

The Cubs traded Eloy the year after winning the World Series, so not sure how much basking Theo was really doing about that move

Patrick Newman is legit, looks like Tomoyuki Sugano is going to be posted for sure: Sugano is arguably the best pitcher in Japan, and is certainly the most polished. He sits low 90's but can touch the mid-90's when he needs to. Like Darvish, he has a lot of different breaking pitches that are variations on sliders/sinkers. He's got elite control -- he gets lot of strikeouts by tunneling his various pitches and making the hitters guess which way they'll break. He's extremely competitive, carries a lot of swag and he's earned it. The raw stuff is a tick below where Tanaka was when he came, but the control is better and the arsenal is wider. He's been the ace of Samurai Japan for a while now, and has performed well against international competition, including the relatively stacked 2017 Team USA squad. The downsides: he's 31 years old, missed most of last year to injury, and has apparently been pitching with a partially torn UCL for many years. It hasn't been a performance problem for him, but you have to wonder if the TJ could come at any moment. I think this guy is a solid #3 in the MLB with less performance risk than the typical NPB import. Ohtani notwithstanding, he's the best to be posted since Tanaka.

All we need is Bauer. Let the roulette wheel keep spinning on 1 yr. stop gaps in RF ,a reliever to replace Colome or Colome himself, and run with that. Let Cease and Dunning be 4 and 5 . See who's non tendered and see what else we can come up with. If we can't sign Bauer divide what we were willing to pay Bauer among 2 other starting pitchers.

Madrigal isn't an untouchable for me and neither is Cease. Cease has wicked stuff but has no idea where any of it is going. Looking at his delivery, it's hard to see how he can gain enough control and command, because you can't pinpoint a delivery issue with him like you could with Giolito. I think Giolito would have been good a lot earlier in his career if the Nationals would have just let him be and not changed his delivery after dominating AA. Madrigal is an interesting case. He wasn't as good of a defender and baserunner as advertised during his first stint in the Bigs, but as a hitter he was as advertised. I guess, with all of the position players that the Sox have, I'd be most willing to move him.

Reading various threads talking about trading this or that guy is distressing to me, because I think the White Sox shouldn't be thinking about trading any core player, and they have a lot of them. This is my untouchables list. Tim Anderson, 27, signed through 2024 Luis Robert, 23, signed through 2027 Eloy Jimenez, 24 (in 2 days), signed through 2026 Yoan Moncada, 25, signed through 2025 Andrew Vaughn, 22, with full control, including when his service date starts Nick Madrigal, 23, with only one year of service time used Jose Abreu, 33, MVP in 2020, signed through 2022 Yasmani Grandal, 32, signed through 2023 That is 8/9ths of your starting lineup. The reason they should all be untouchable is because: A. All except Abreu and Grandal are on the upswing of their careers, with a high likelihood that they will all get better over the next few years. B. All except Abreu are signed or controlled for the next 3 years, and most are controlled through 4 years (Anderson), 5 years (Moncada and Madrigal?), 6 years (Jimenez and Vaughn?), or 7 years (Robert). C. There is no one in the Sox farm system that could reasonably take over for ANY of these players. So if you trade any of them, you then need to find someone to replace them, and it will most likely be a far lesser player. D. Andrew Vaughn, who often comes up in trade comments, is the core offensive player under the longest control (he could tie Robert if the Sox start him late this year to add a service time year), and with tremendous upside. There is no way the Sox would get his value back in trade because he's still an unknown. Plus, not only does he anchor the DH spot that has been a huge hole in the Sox lineup, he can help extend Abreu by splitting time at 1B. I would also add some pitchers to the untouchables list Michael Kopech, 24, under control through 2024 Dylan Cease, 24, under control through 2025 Garrett Crochet, 21, under control through 2026? Lucas Giolito, 26, under control through 2023 Why am I adding these pitchers? A. Michael Kopech is an unknown at this point, but should be ready in 2021. Because he's an unknown, he will not bring back value equal to his upside, which is considerable. B. Dylan Cease has been a disappointment, but has electric stuff. Like Kopech, he won't bring back value equal to his upside. I want to see if our new pitching coach can do anything close for Cease for what he did for Giolito. He also doesn't need to improve as much as Giolito did to be a very solid 3-4 starter. And he might be better than that. C. Garrett Crochet might become the Sox' best pitcher. D. Giolito may end up not staying, depending on his contract demands. But if you ultimately have to trade him, this year is too early. Better to try to extend him before he puts together another excellent year. My overall opinion is the White Sox have one of the best young cores in MLB. (I don't follow other teams closely enough to say exactly where we rank.) It's taken years to assemble this group, but they've done so, and they've locked most of them up for a very nice run. The Sox need to supplement them to complete the team, but they can't rob from Peter to pay Paul. They must find ways to add without subtracting.

Maybe this shouldn't be a new topic but what is with all this talk about trading our young players away? I just don't understand the thinking behind it. it hijacks every thread with ridiculous trade ideas. Why does Vaughn's name come up in every trade and why are some posters in such a hurry to get rid of the guy? I heard it all last year and now this year as well. It's not a stretch to think he might end up being our best hitter down the road. Madrigal looks like a 300 plus hitter and all that with a bad shoulder. And I wouldn't trade Kopech until I see him for a full year without or without him being a possible head case. And I even saw Garret Crochet name come up along with Robert. INSANE. I will be sooooo pissed if we trade any of these guys. I don't care who we get in return like Snell or Marquez. And don't even get me started on Lance Lynn. Please!!! I don't post a lot but just felt I had to say it because I get nauseous every time I see these names come up. just saying

When they do bullshit like this it makes me wonder if Samson is right about Jerry wanting to finish in 2nd every year.

I second this. You all are great people and fun to have good times and bad times with. I hope we can all get behind this team and support them because they need it. We are in a once and a sports lifetime here and should enjoy every minute of it. Happy Turkey Day my fellow Sox Fanatics.

This thread is terrible

The good old American fable.

Whatever. I can sleep well knowing I have worn my mask throughout and have basically only put myself at risk on a handful of occasions eating with a buddy or relative at a restaurant (usually outdoors, always with mask), going to Mass, going to the barber. Yes I can hold a discussion about how unfair I feel and felt it is for government officials to say 'Do as I say not as I do.' And the ilk. You are very wrong that I have not taken this seriously. I have basically been a recluse working remotely, declining travel, wearing my mask. Nothing I can do to change anybody's opinion on a message board so I won't try. I don't think I'm evil; if you think I am evil, peace. I'm going to try to start posting less because my opinions evolve, certainly evolve in a span of nine months. And I don't do a good job of expressing my feelings. As far as the governor, she did a better job when she actually started seeking other people's opinions, medical opinions, rather than making dictatorial decisions on her own. Remember back in March/April, governors were out of line huffing and puffing in harsh language. As this thing continued, the governor "lightened up" a bit and actually stopped talking down to people. I'd never vote for her again but she improved her demeanor. As a citizen and taxpayer I have a right to feel this way about her.

I think you've confused being on social media with working hard to accomplish goals.

Yea keep your guys in these uncertain times. Spend a little dough and buy Kopech some time to develop into a free ace. Trading these guys is beyond insane. And for Snell??!? Good Lord. Get deGrom with Vaughn and Kopech. I wouldn’t like that but I guess I’d understand at least. Blake Snell? GTFOH

Or the Padres with the Clevinger trade to a lesser extent. We need to add a #2 or #3 starter, but we also have to smart about it because pitching is volatile. Giving up a Kopech or a Vaughn is a big deal and should be avoided unless it’s for a perfect piece. Not sure Snell qualifies as that as much as I like him.

It's an honor good sir. I have to serve as the beacon of sanity here from time to time

You only have time to post every one of their rumors?

The Bush-style immigration bill could probably get 52-53 votes, including extra border security and a path to citizenship with a large fee and an expanded guest-worker program. But it would never come to the floor with Mitch McConnell as Majority Leader. If the senate is 50/50 with Harris as the deciding vote for a Majority Leader, a bill that would have been seen as a compromise in 2007 could pass. If the Senate were 50/50, the DREAM act will pass easily within weeks, eliminating the need for DACA. There's already probably 60+ votes for it, maybe more. It could have passed any year for the past 8 years if McConnell wasn't in charge.

I hear you. However no deal is a sure thing. Let's say we give up Vaughn and Dunning for Snell and Snell hurts himself in spring training. Snell sits out a season and Dunning starts 25 games. Sure its outlandish and sometimes you need to take risks but it is still premature for the Sox to be trading prospects. Perhaps come July if we're sitting 10 over .500 and the perfect piece is out there but free agency is where 100 % of the focus should be right now.

It's not the FA options that our limited. There are sufficient options that we could fill all of the team's needs. It is the team's willingness to spend that money that we expect to be limited.

1. Absolutely the DREAM ACT should be signed into law. 2. Increase the number of refugees allowed in. 3. Bar/deport serious criminals who enter. 4. Pathway to citizenship for law-abiding undocumented immigrants otherwise not covered by other legal statuses; if you get a hair up your ass to enforce some sort of penalty, make it a fine of some sort, proportionate to an immigrants means. 5. No wall; its a complete fucking waste of time and money. 6. End the travel ban. Did I miss anything?

Giving up 2 or 3 top prospects is not the way to have long term success. Three quality arms are the requirement to win playoff baseball. We currently have two. I'm counting on the new pitching coach to unlock Cease, Dunning, and/or Kopech. The two Quintana types I suggested are to hold down the fort until someone figures it out. Should a stud be needed...trades can still be accomplished before the trade deadline. As I have said before...we have paid a high price in losing seasons and trading good players to be where we are today. No way do I want to pull a Cubs and return to crap in 3 or 4 years.

Agree on the relieving part, not the James Paxton part. His flexor strain and back surgery are quite a lethal combination in my opinion but i get your drift. Maybe the $1m bonuses are for starts and/or saves.☺️

For discussion sake I'm gonna assume that the Sox can't or won't sign Bauer for their rotation. I'll also assume that they can't put a reasonable deal together for a trade of prospects for a good starter with multiple years of control. Both of these assumptions could very well be valid impediments to shore up the starting staff. We've all written off Rodon as a member of this team because he's always hurt and has been around long enough to be in line for a high ($4.5m) arbitration award. How about some kind of offer that protects each side. The Sox need starters, preferably left handed to balance their staff. He once had TOR stuff and it might still be better than the non-Bauer FA group of Tanaka, Odorizzi, Quintana, etc. The Sox should know his health better than all others and I'm assuming he's 100% good now. From his (and his agents) standpoint, he's about to be non-tendered into a huge and growing pool of unemployed players. He's gone on record as saying that he is not interested in a bullpen position so it's starter or bust, which also might dampen interest in him. What do you all think of offering something along the lines of a base MLB contract of $3m with 3 $1m bonuses at say 10 starts, 20 starts and 30 starts? Rodon gets to remain a starter and rebuild some earning power while at the same time reaching his arb number if he can stay healthy and effective. The Sox get to potentially fill out their rotation with a younger, equally effective starter without paying $12 to $14m or trading from a thin farm inventory. If he shows up to camp out of shape or hurt again you cut him and go to war with Kopech and Cease in those last 2 spots. Also you now have the payroll space to go hard after Springer. Whatch you think?

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

Ditto. I found this site in 2015 and it has been a fantastic outlet for me to talk about the Sox. I've been here throughout the rebuild...that says something about this site lol.

Oh yea it's totally all about you ! You're welcome.

Nice thread @CaliSoxFanViaSWside ! Wishing everyone here a Happy Thanksgiving full of food, family, friends and fun. Also, thanks to the Staff and Owners, who operate the site. I'm new here, was a long time poster on WSI, looking forward to hopefully the best decade of White Sox baseball!

We already have a TOR starter and two more in training. Spend the money on Springer and a couple #4 types along with a good RP. With that lineup we aren't going to have many 1-0 games.

Madrigal isn't going to be traded. I doubt Kopech or Vaughn will be either. Stand pat. Hold on to your cards.

I’d rather read Jason Kinander tweets than this thread

Trust me, you'd feel safe in our church on Sunday. 3 to a pew max and it's a long pew. About 30-50 people total for 45 minute Mass (masks required) in a HUGE church. This folks is not a problem. Just is not.

Welcome to Soxtalk Mr. Boone Logan!!

Not really. The primary thing anyone puts into it is time, and no one's getting it back.

People on here seem to have no issue punting on years of the window like last year. If a trade comes along and he needs to be in a package for a controllable pitcher they need to let him go. We need pitching ASAP. We could have used someone in the playoffs.

I mean you're betting on Snell being the guy he was 3 yearscago.

"Check out these pitches from three years and a UCL ago"

I think what he means by sure thing is you know the guy can pitch well consistently in the MLB. Kopech and Dunning have not done that as of yet. There is hope, but it hasn't been done. Trades have to be evaluated based on what is, not what if someone gets hurt next year.

What do you guys think should be done to immigration laws, especially if the congress goes 50/50? Are any reforms from previous legislation relevant or helpful towards a new bill? I’m not looking for an “enforcing the laws” answer because there is much more nuance than that.

You called your governor a dictator for trying to keep you,your family, and your friends healthy and alive. Sorry, you have not always taken this seriously. Not even close.

I'm not going to put a lot of advanced stats in this post. I will leave others to do that. But I was thinking this morning as I wrote my "Untouchables" post about the White Sox offense and how it could be the best in the AL in 2021. In 2020, in the AL the Sox were 2nd to the Yankees (315) with 306 runs. 2nd in OPS+ to the Yankees (117) with 113. 1st in HR with 96 1st in slugging at .453 Yet, they gave a huge number of ABs to Edwin Encarnacion, who slashed .157/.250./.377 with an OPS+ of 70. They also gave a lot of ABs to Nomar Mazara, who slashed .228/.295/.294 with an OPS+ of 64. There is no question that Andrew Vaughn as the primary DH will destroy EE's DH numbers. Right field, on the other hand, is still an open question. If the Sox fill that slot with Joc Pederson, he put up an OPS+ of 127 as recently as 2019. Then you look at the rest of the lineup. Tim Anderson, 27, put up a better year in 2020 than he did in 2019. He could still get better. Yoan Moncada, 25, went from 140 OPS+ in 2019 to 94 OPS+ in 2020, mostly because of the lingering effects of COVID. I would expect him to bounce back. Luis Robert, 23, started hot but then went ice cold, only to start to find his stroke by the playoffs. Expect him to make major strides. Eloy Jimenez, 24, is going to continue to solidify his game. Nick Madrigal, 23, is just a really good hitter. Jose Abreu, 33, is unlikely to repeat as MVP, but he's driven to win a championship, so who knows how long he can keep up his play Yasmani Grandal, 32, hit about as well as he has for years. With the upside of the Sox youth, and the fact that they only have one hole to fill -- right field -- if Vaughn holds down the DH spot, the Sox offense should be even better in 2021 than they were this year, when they were already in the top 1-2 offenses in the AL. This is why the Sox should not consider trading any of their core offensive players for pitchers. The Sox can fill their few holes from within, or in free agency, without weakening their offensive strength.

Players like Snell and Bryant would be interesting, but dammit I love what this team already has

Never Robert Jiminez Child Please Giolito Anderson Moncada Abreu Needs to be a top 10 player package Kopech Vaughn Crochet

Long LONG time lurker and I had to find my username and password to add my two cents to this whole thing. Greg I get why you are pulling to extremes on this stuff. It’s easy. It’s the way media is going because that is what gets eye balls. But you really need to fight against it. I was really curious about your claim that Portland was still rioting so I did some googling. If you believe that broken windows and graffiti constitutes rioting then Chicago has been rioting since the day I was born… The answer to mass media issues isn’t watching some guy in Portland hunting down antifa, home video style. I watched about 10 minutes of one of those videos you posted and I had to stop. The guy in the video was even talking about the protestors like they were the enemy. It’s toxic and unhealthy. The most important thing is that this is a both sides issue and It’s important that you know that I’m not the left attacking the right. I have a buddy at work that thinks socialism is the golden answer to all of Americas problems and every time a black person is killed by a cop its cold blooded murder. And I tell him this for everything he gets ticked off by. Take some time and find information about the issue from as many sources as you can. None will be 100% truth or fact but you can build a pretty good idea as to what the truth and facts are. Mr. portland antifa hunter isn't the authority on Portland and their unrest.

Dude, his act is lame. I agree with you that there are many ways to serve. But, greg specifically said he'd die for this country, when he had a hard time putting on a mask and staying home. (His haircuts!) You and I both know people who actually have given their lives, or limbs, or their sanity for this country. And it is THAT specific sacrifice that is debased by a freedom freeloader who tosses a statement out like his. YMMV. Insofar as border/immigration control, Im the son of a parent who was at one time undocumented. Yet my father got his documentation, raised a family, and gave us more opportunity than most. He also provided 3 of his sons to serve this country, which is far more than most native-born Americans. (How many Trumps or Limbaughs or Carlsons served?) I just don't know that xenophobia posed as "border control" is as cut and dried as it is proposed by Trump. I'm hoping that we have a 50/50 split senate after the Georgia elections. That way, rather than pure McConnell obstruction, we can have sensible debate led by Centrists. And thus, we can come up with sensible solutions to many of the issues we face as a country. With a 50/50 split, moderates will have the bully pulpit, NOT "edge lords" on the far right or far left.

Guys, the election is over. We can stop pretending COVID is a thing.

I'm gonna camp outside of the Pfizer factory like people usually do for Black Friday sales. Get that primo vaccine right off the line while it's still hot. e: makes me wonder what the security profile around these facilities and the transportation/storage is going to look like.