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Voted today for the first time in my life.

I fucking hate Florida

Luis Robert wins Gold Glove. First of many.

Trump has never committed a crime while in office that I am aware of. Biden and Clinton were in office when their "indiscretions" happened.

If we trade Cease for Marquez, that would mean we basically got Eloy and Marquez for Quintana. And while we're at it, we might as well sign Quintana. Then that would mean we got Eloy and Marquez for renting out Quintana for a couple years.

Guys...just using Eloy is a proxy for fair value (79). You do not get Marquez for Cease, Kopech or Vaughn nor any 2 of the 3.

I'm not sure what this board's obsession is with trading Eloy. He'll be on the White Sox for a long time. Vaughn or Kopech will likely suffice as the centerpiece for Marquez, even with the insane value of his contract. But I don't see the Sox pulling the trigger there.

Think back to 25 year old you. If someone had come in with all of the titles and accolades in the world, but crapped on you personally and everything you believed in, and didn't spend anytime to act like they cared what you thought, would you respect them? Especially with their entire public history contradicting their most recent public statements, especially if you had been led to believe that the person was originally supposed to be someone who you did have some excitement about having as a leader? People want a level of respect before they give respect. I don't buy that anyone is just going to blindly accept one part of the resume, but not the rest.

Joe is certainly in a compromised position with any deals where he makes trade deals with the Chinese. Time will tell if his actions were treason or not. A biased press does not help get to the bottom of these revelations but they will come out eventually. On a side note...why do you suppose contributions to the Clinton Foundation dried up after she lost her bid for the Presidency? Maybe the Chinese were hoping to have access to Joe Biden. Crooks!

It's funny, you attacked just about every well know democratic politician, then called yourself a victim of attack.

If there's one thing I've never met in my life, it's a silent Trump supporter. Fuckers will bring up politics and Trump no matter what the subject. "Pretty good salad, eh Bill?" "Yeah, enjoy it before AOC and the Green New Deal takes away our farms!" "I mean, I was just saying it was a good salad, Bill."

Then you should stop looking at BB Trade Values.

The bolded is your opinion. I do not believe in the richest country on earth we should have homeless people begging for money and sleeping on the street. We can pull money out of our asses to give 5T to rich fucks but we cry poor when it comes to helping our most vulnerable. The US a fucking failed state. Just because some are doing well and think all is good in their egocentric bubbles doesn't mean other people are doing great. If we start taking care of our vulnerable population America will run like a fine tuned machine. The rich people will still get their dough because people will have money to spend. Not everyone can work or find great jobs... your location and the local economy dictate what jobs are available for the most part. That is why metro areas have the most people... more opportunities in theory. The last part, you're telling me some poor broke ass person could easily find a house if they wanted? I would give you whatever odds you want in a wager you're dead wrong. The government's job isn't necessarily to be a nanny to its people but to have resources available to help people who are down in a succinct manner. If this pandemic taught the US anything, it should be that this country is a virus away from totally crumbling and that's because its foundation is weak.

Good for you, you're one person. These policies help the mass amount of people that aren't able to get by. I'm well off but I know these policies will help my fellow man and I care about my neighbors. Pretty selfish on my part.

"The media likes to blame my husband for his behavior" -Melania Trump So unfair.

You have to be a fake person

Of which, the President has plenty of both as well.

Yes, because clearly people who vote for the POTUS don't matter unless the people also vote for Senators that support that party... Think about how stupid your sentence is. The goal of elections isn't to fracture the legislative body and not allow a POTUS to get anything accomplished; if that was the case, the POTUS would be elected by the Senate. You keep saying elections have consequences, but it appears Republicans weren't themselves willing to deal with those consequences because they just pretended the people never voted for Obama. McConnell openly bragged about blocking everything of Obama's; that's not politics buddy, that's abusing the power you were given, and IGNORING the people and the vote to push one narrative in absence of the people's voice.

Except there are 26 actual allegations out there when it comes to sexual assault and the President, most dating to long before his political career got going.

Every since work from home started, I have my office phone forwarded to my cell, so I am not really sure on some calls. So far the IRS and Federal Reserve both have warrants for my arrest. Jaime Dimon wants to lower my credit card rates, my "electric provider" wants to give me a discount if I just hold on, and an offer to extend my car warranty comes in daily, even though the car I drive is in my wife's name.

Am I missing something here? Marquez is good and cheap but Chris Sale he is not. I know you said "Sale lite" but that still feels crazy steep. Sale had a career ERA of 3, had been an All-Star 5 times, and had received Cy Young votes in each of those seasons and MVP votes twice. He also had 4 years of team control left. These situations aren't all that similar in my eyes.

No. They are out there. Republicans against Trump. Lincoln Project. Generals. Miles Taylor....where have you ever seen this before? Trump will lose as long as the vote is not suppressed. But that seems to be OK with the republican party. Why? For all these rights, like not having to wear a mask to protect your neighbor and family and friends, why is it OK to try to take someone's vote away just because they may not be voting for your candidate? Why was Marco Rubio praising the Trumpers who were trying to run a Biden bus off the road, and calling them patriots? Would dems be patriots if they did the same to a Rubio bus with his wife and kids inside?

Not a silent majority. It’s a silent minority (and not very silent) that has gotten two presidents elected because of an archaic rule in our system despite losing the popular vote.

When your party is represented by Donald Trump, Mike Pence, Mitch McConnell, Lindsay Graham, Rush Limbaugh and Rand Paul...you will not convert many liberals to your cause.

Honestly if you believe it is pointless to argue politics than maybe you shouldn't come into this thread and troll it disingenuously. Just a thought

This is always pointless to argue politics. You want the highly populated states to more or less pick the President. I on the other hand look at how Democrats have mismanaged virtually every large city they run into near Bankruptcy. Nancy's district in SanFrancisco has crap in the streets and you what small-town America to follow suit. No thanks! For the record...I voted for Carter (big mistake) and have no bone to pick with JFK or LBJ. I wasn't wild about Bill Clinton or Barack Obama but I managed to not riot in the street. Mayor Richard J. Daley was an excellent mayor IMO. When your party is represented by Nancy Pelosi, AOC, Bernie Sander, Elizabeth Warren, Al Sharpton, and Chuck Schumer... you will not convert many conservatives to your cause.

You should take an open minded look at universal healthcare. The US pays a much higher percentage of it's GDP than any of it's western allies with socialized medicine. Universal healthcare is objectively cheaper.

Fair enough Kyle, but agreeing to disagree implies some gray area of fact to me; there's no gray areas here. Reality has happened, and pushing incorrect intelligence information that cost us the lives of thousands of innocent Americans, and millions of innocent people in the Middle East, isn't an opinion as much as it's a misinformation campaign to support a cause that is dangerous and harmful. That said, I am getting off lunch in about 5 minutes so the thread won't be cluttered for long and I'll respectfully bow out to allow you guys to continue on with your cordial conversation. BTW, democrats are every bit as complicit in this wealth gap divide over the past fifty years if that makes people feel less attacked ha.

This is one of the dumbest tropes to emerge from this election. Biden is a stutterer. Sometimes the guy has to take a second to translate his thoughts into formed words so that they come out without a stutter, because that process takes longer for him than most people. It is an intentional technique designed to reduce stuttering. The fact the President has turned it into an issue should be enough to disqualify him from the highest office in the land.

I’m pretty sure Colorado would trade Marquez for Kopech and Vaughn...

Also two abject failures of the US

So wait, they deserve it? Yes, much of them are addicted to Opiods - that were pushed by the Sacklers not as medication, but a drug of addiction that would enrich their family and destroy the lives of millions. The sacklers got rich and now face no true accountability for being the largest drug dealers on the planet; meanwhile, poor people go to jail for selling a gram of weed. Or, many of them are soldiers suffering from PTSD that they acquired by being forced into meaningless wars that were fought in the name of oil and money for defense companies. But yes, tell us how you empathize with people who you go on to state deserve their fate. We have degraded the safety net in this country over the past fifty years to reinvest that money into a very finite percentage of the population so they could live lavishly and without accountability.

We are just going to agree to disagree and that's fine. May you never be in a vulnerable state and I drive by you because I thought you were a failed human being.

Housing, food, and health care should be universal rights for the richest country on earth. But but but.... the poor people should just try harder. Says the archaic dinosaurs that grew up in a generation in which the inequality was no where near where it is today.

Anyone who ignores that this is a welfare state for the rich and not the poor has their head buried in the sand. Period, end of story. It is free-market ruthless capitalism for everyone but the filthy rich people who say it's the only way to succeed. We can't help homeless people and the struggling, but we can allow the rich to steal billions upon billions and then bail them out when they commit fraud. I'm amazed at how many people don't see how ass backwards the system works.

When 65-70% of economic activity is generated from/by blue states and 65% of Federal government spending is reallocated to those red states, like Kentucky, for example...something is radically wrong. How could anyone argue that’s fair or equitable? Or that not even 1/3rd of Americans believe a woman’s right to get an abortion should be limited in the first two trimesters...and it certainly doesn’t make any sense when fewer and fewer people believe in God or go to church each year, but we’re going to set the clock back 40 years because of 87,000 votes in PA, MI, and WI four years ago? Or that those same 87,000 voters are going to potentially throw 20,000,000+ people off their health insurance in the middle of a pandemic?

So far, it looks like there are big turnouts today. This, in addition to the huge early vote counts ensures a voter turnout unlike anything we've seen. It's hard to say for sure, but I would think bigger turnout favors Biden and the Democrats. I keep thinking about 2016 and seeing that over 100 million people didn't vote. Hopefully we've learned from that. My two oldest are 19 and 18, and they voted in their first presidential election today. They are just two of a large group of new voters who have seen what has happened over the past four years. Regardless of who young voters vote for, they will have an impact on this election, 2022, 2024, and beyond.

Its a nice goalpost move, but he didn't take a decade off of baseball, he took a decade off of managing. He hasn't done the job for 10 years now. "a different perspective" isn't doing the job. The job has changed a TON during that time. While you claim his track record should earn "respect", you ignore everything that doesn't fit that mantra. There is a lot about his record that earns him fear and trepidation. And yes you are pretending to know what it will take to manager the White Sox, by repeatedly excusing all of the problems in his history, and repeatedly pointing to his track record as an absolution that all of those things will be over come by it. This has already gone badly. The White Sox are the laughing stock of baseball with this hire, free agents are already reacting badly, and his own players are being ignored. This isn't a hindsight situation. When there are this many red flags, it is more than acceptable to be critical in the moment.

Okay, it's been fun debating. Going to leave this topic. If you haven't voted, please do so today.

I don't think there is any way Hahn is trading Cease for 1 year of anybody.

Yet he hasn't reached out to his own team yet. How many managers would have done (or more accurately NOT DONE) that?

You are opining that the opposite of all of them. Which means you are making arguments despite your opinion that you have no authority to do so. The problem is that every single one of your arguments are contradicted by Tony's own words, or the words of people who have played for him. Also if a person in my field took a decade off of doing my job, they would no longer understand the federal rule set, which is kind of the point of SEC compliance, and proves my point.

You quite literally are by making every single contra-argument after listing off why you couldn't possibly know. Your thought would have more validity if you hadn't, but you continue to so so.

Stroman had three seasons out of four from 2016 to 2019 with at least 3.3 fWAR. Overall during that period he put up the 22nd most fWAR in baseball. He’s not a #1 starter by any means, but he’s only 29, his pitching profile fits our ballpark & team perfectly, and he can be a low-end #2 or high-end #3 in a playoff rotation. To me, he’s a clear cut above any free agent starter not named Bauer. Would I prefer a legit #1 starter? Of course I would, but I’m not going to pass on Stroman if said player isn’t out there and doesn’t come at a reasonable cost, whether financially or in terms of prospect capital.

Your own list was 1. Never managed a major league baseball game in their lives. 2. Never played major league baseball. 3. Never served as a major league baseball executive You've done none of these things. If you are going to use these as a basis to lecture the anti-TLR crowd, then you have already shot your own argument in the foot. The rest of is just mental gymnastics. I have no problem calling this for what it is, a rash move made without considering an impressive slate of potential candidates which are/were out there that we could have gone to without Tony's considerable baggage. The fact that TLR's "considerable track record" ends a decade ago. Baseball has changed A TON in that decade. TLR has contradicted the statements he made this week, with others made very recently about how he wouldn't incorporate data once a game started. Why are we supposed to only believe the statements that fit your argument, even though he has consistently made the same statements until someone started paying him again? It doesn't strike me as authentic at all. The fact that while he might have said the right things in some people's point of view during his most recent interviews, he has done other recent views which contradict these words mere months ago. His ACTIONS of supporting anti-Black and anti-Latino causes IS going to raise eyebrows. His lack of contacting players ISN'T going to make anyone feel better. Even it is eventually rectified, players are going to wonder why it took so long to reach out to them. While a guy like Maxwell has taken to Tony's defense, there are PLENTY of players who had large problems with him, and NONE have spoken up here. These accusations aren't new. With the steroid era, people keep using the idea that EVERYONE WAS DOING IT as some sort of a defense for this. Tony's team's had major steroid systems in place, and were operating in the open, and were even an open joke in front of the media. He knew what was going on, and did nothing to stop it. AJ Hinch at least sort of tried to put on a show of stopping things. TLR gave it is tacit endorsement by ignoring it completely. He's never been brought to reckoning for it either. There are also the Jack McDowell accusations of an organized sign stealing operation that have never been addressed. At the end of the day, none of us owe Tony Larussa anything. The idea we do owe him something with all of these other things hanging there over him is absurd. I am not afraid to question his hire, and no one else should be either. There is no reason at all where he can't be questioned as well as the process that brought him here.

Since WHEN IS STROMAN A HIGHER IMPACT STARTER!?!?!?!?! This board has absolutely lost it with the Stroman love.

She couldn't even name the protected rights of the first amendment ffs

Trump is only 3 years younger and got COVID a few weeks ago. I get that Biden would be the oldest president, but it's not like the alternative (Trump) is a 45 year old in great shape without any existing medical conditions.

And sometime tomorrow I’ll post the same information you so skillfully refuted.

The thing about Bochy is he won three world series with teams that were very good but not stacked with dominant players, like LaRussa's teams or the Dodgers or Hinch's Astros. If those teams didn't come away with a World Series it would have been an abject failure. Bochy won with good teams playing tight, sound baseball. Any of Bochy's teams lose in the championship series, they could've said, hey, we still had a hell of a year.