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It's two games, which followed an amazing comeback. Which capped off an amazing run that included a no-hitter, 4 straight homers, Abreu murdering the Cubs, Dunning's emergence, Anderson establishing his stardom, Eloy moonlighting as a landscaper, and more. Moncada is clearly not feeling well, Bummer is out, Vaughn and other prospects are still developing. Yes, this team has holes, but unless you're the Dodgers, every team has holes. This is year one of the window. The sky isn't falling.

I like James McCann. He's turned himself into a quality mlb starting catcher. Chances are, he would get very exposed playing everday, just like he did last year. 1st half stat 2019 line: .316/.371/.502 2nd half 2019 stat line: .226/.281/.413 career stat line: .250/.301/.391 Chances are, if you play McCann everyday, you're getting a .250/.300/.400 type hitter. This is not the type of hitter that makes you pass on 3.5-5 fWAR catcher in Grandal, who also happens to fill two of the other main weaknesses of the ball club (strong OBP and lineup balance). Grandal will be fine, but people need to stop expecting a .300 hitter. He is a career .240 hitter. But he gets on base 35% of the time, which this lineup sorely needs. He's not really a middle of the order bopper though, and it would help if RR moved him down.

HEY GUYS IF YOU SEE A LINK THAT SAYS "LUIS ROBERT NUDES" DO NOT CLICK IT. IT'S A VIRUS THAT WILL MAKE YOUR KEYBOARD BE STUCK ON CAPS LOCK

He's not very good with balls in the dirt either. The Sox should think long and hard before they let McCann walk out the door this winter.

Very lucky to have met him out here a few times in Napa. First time, he HECKLED me while I was throwing wiffle balls to my then 5 year old kid while wearing a white Sox hat at the local burger joint. Said I needed to throw strikes. Second time was a few years ago at our bakery while in line - his hands were filthy and he had pruning shears on his belt. We talked briefly about harvest. He was a legit farmer and loved the work. Third time was a couple years ago when he threw out the first pitch for our local little league. God rest his soul - he was a great talent and man!

I've never been in the Rick Renteria should be fired club. I've been in the Rick Hahn should be fired club for years. After last nights game I'm beginning to wonder about Renteria. Last nights game was probably the worse game of the season. Hopefully the team will put the game behind them and start winning again. Still, last night Steve Stone said that McCann had the best White Sox hitting results against Berrios. Yet McCann sat on the bench last night. The White Sox have a DH whos not hitting his weight against anybody and he was in the lineup instead of McCann. When I see things like this I actually wonder how serious the White Sox management team is about actually winning games.

No clue who this is but LMAO

Of course we need to give Madrigal an off day today guys... He is only hitting .474 since coming back!

Samson says Reinsdorf said always finish in second Jesus fucking christ knock it off with these conspiracy theories. The guy forked over like 150M in new players this offseason + about 140M in extensions this past offseason. Why is this being brought up right now in THIS thread? Because Renteria is a "cheap" manager? Get the fuck out of here. Because at the present moment the team is 7 games above .500 and a W out of first place? You really enjoy getting the board fired up, huh @Jack Parkman? There are a select group of trolls on this board and you're certainly one of them. You're a disgrace

Its funny, there is no need to look up scores or follow a game. All you need to do is look at thread titles on Soxtalk to know if the team won or lost last night.

Im not sure i trust our teams medical staff any more with how many injuries our guys have suffered the last few years.

A streaky hitter who is currently not hitting should not be in the 3 hole. That is my current problem with Grandal (actually more with Ricky). Add to that the case that it does not seem last year was a fluke for McCann, and the frustration is enhanced.

And never posted an OPS over .798 in A ball. I get that he's the "other option" which automatically gets him love. Sort of like the "backup quarterback fallacy" in football. I also get that he's a young, talented player we have big hopes for. But I am very puzzled by the nature of some of these posts. - Not only is he ready to come up and face big league pitching. - Not only is he ready to be successful in a big league role. - NOT ONLY... is he ready to play EVERY DAY. - NOT ONLY... is he the answer to the biggest problem in our lineup, at a position he has NEVER played. - He is ALSO ready to be our #3 hitter and a central piece of our lineup as we contend for an AL Central title! Wow! How convenient is that!? I mean, what a coincidence that this guy whose been down at the training site, just HAPPENS to be the answer to all of our problems? Every. Single. Solitary. ONE. Gee... if I didn't know any better - I would say that SoxTalk is getting a bit ahead of themselves. But nah... we'd never do that I want Vaughn up here and getting a chance as well. But let's turn the volume down... just a tad, eh?

Grandal is underperforming a little but he still has a quite solid season. Sure you would want him a bit better and he will likely get there but he always was a streaky hitter who strikes out and gets a lot of his value by walks. He is only hitting 226 but has a 345 obp and a solid 106 wRC+. He also has 0.7 war which is a 3 war full season pace. That is not quite what you hoped for but he definitely isn't a black hole and only should get better.

We back!

Blaming Grandal? He didn't ask for it down the center. Unreal complaining.

McCann has an OPS of 1.357 vs LHP. Inexcusable to not play him the last two nights.

Wut

Grandal hitting at the top of the lineup again. Why no McCann again?

Probably for the best. Getting hammered for 2-3 innings a go isn't going to help him figure out whats wrong. I would guess we see him as a reliever at the end of the season.

If Ricky got fired tomorrow. What other MLB team gives him a chance to lead their team.

A ~.800 OPS in August/September shouldn’t be discounted. That’s solid for a starting catcher late in the regular season. In summary, he had a bad July.

I think you greatly underestimate James McCann. I see a guy who worked hard to change his approach at the plate and became a much better hitter because of it. He is completely changed form the hitter he was in Detroit. I think you over simplify things by showing the first half and second half numbers from last year. Going month by month you get: April .357/.400/.536 May .338./372/.514 June .275/.363.500 July .173/.212/.309 Aug .274/.330/.476 Sept .250/.314/.453 One horrible month of July is really dragging down the second half numbers. it looks to me like the pitchers finally made an adjustment to him in July and he had to adjust against that. He may not put up those first half stats over a full season but I believe he is clearly much better than a .250/.300/.400 hitter.

Yea but McCann has a .420 OBP, does he deserve to keep getting benched in preference for Grandal? White Sox spent a lot on Grandal and just because that they are likely to keep giving him more playing time. Sadly, it seems we spent a lot of money on an area where we already had a great player who wasn't just a fluke that many assumed. I don't expect him to keep a .420 OBP and almost 1.000 OPS but clearly McCann has upped his game since he joined the White Sox.

Again, i know this will turn into the resign McCann thread, but there is no way the dude is signing on to be a back up for the next three years. The sooner people give up that idea, the less miserable they will be this winter when he moves on.

Grandal has .7 WAR already.. On pace for 1.4ish WAR.. Which in a normal year would be about a 4.2 WAR season... He doesn't have a high batting average and never will.. I see you use that as the be all, end all.. Stop it. Encarnacion, Cishek and Gonzalez were cheap deals so absolutely nothing is/was hurt by signing them...

Renteria is incompetent at this job. But it shouldn't have been last night's game to come to this conclusion. However, I'd launch Rick Hahn right along with him for his continued failures in free agency and veteran trades. The only veteran worth a damn from this offseason has been Keuchel. Grandal, EE, Mazara, Cishek, Gonzalez have all been terrible. Renteria can only play the players handed to him.

I'd be surprised if we EVER see Kopech pitch.

Here is the full list for our midseason top 30: https://www.futuresox.com/2020/09/03/top-30-white-sox-prospect-rankings-midseason-2020/

Cleveland's offense is like 27th.

Yeah. Maybe 2022 at the earliest for a guy like Jared Kelley

Yeah, hilarious. The implication by you and others is that Reinsdorf spent just enough money to finish in second, so when he woke up yesterday and saw they were in 1st, he was mad.. like "hey Ricky, it's Jerry. Lose tonight. Cleveland's winning. Gotta stay true to my word." Do you know how stupid that sounds? Jerry allegedly wanting to finish second has nothing to do with the fact that they are now in 2nd. They pitched a bozo yesterday and made a ton of errors. It happens The Sox were in 1st a day ago. I can assure you that Parkman was just waiting to get back in 2nd so he can break out that quote again. Which is exactly my point. The quote is being blown way out of proportion. They spent like $300M in total contracts this offseason. Chill

The point was you were cranky about a second place conspiracy and mentioned how we are in second, which is hilarious. Relax and eat a snickers, it's almost a holiday weekend and no need for rage. Jerry told this man that and he has no reason to lie about it, so JR is accountable for the comment. However, I think JR may have meant if you don't have a legit shot to win big you want to remain competitive at the very least.

He's healthy. He's hitting and running. He looks fine at 3B. He's got a long way to go because of the missed time but I still think he's a top 15 prospect in the system because health was the main issue.

The Mazara and EE horrific performances along with McCann performing like an all-start magnify the Grandal's shortcomings.

That ain't gonna work this time. That's why i said last night the FO thinks simply making the playoffs this year is okay because the fans will be content with a postseason appearance, even with a quick exit. As fans, we have to stay on top of these people and make sure they are performing their jobs to the best of their abilities.

Holy shit, man. You want Hahn fired... now? The vision is finally coming together and you want him fired? Calm tf down. Ricky has to go. He will this off-season.

Hahh has done a lot of good in that department. But the GM position is about winning. There have been plenty GMs out there who can build a good farm an good young core of talent, but ultimately you need to get that last push with acquiring veteran talent to get you over the top. Starting from his first veteran move which was Keppinger to today, Rick Hahn has a terrible track record in that department.

He also put Cordero in again when the game was still in reach. Stone called him out on that too by saying something like "didn't think we'd see Cordero today and now he's given up a 2 run homer". Why is he putting in Cordero every game?

Obviously he is not getting fired in season while making the post season but I could see them upgrading next season. I don't think he is as bad as people think because some of his moves are questionable but also caused by constraints of the roster, especially a solid but not very deep bullpen which means that sometimes you have to risk losing a game and hoping a struggling pitcher gets out of it but I also think it would be possible to get an upgrade if the right guy becomes available. Ultimately it will depend on how the team does in the post season. If the sox lose in the first round RR might be gone. But if they make the WS or at least the semifinal (is it still called ALCS?) he will probably stay. I think he is getting along well with the players and keeps them happy so that is worth something but tactically it would be possible to get an upgrade.

And the front office who hired Renteria should not be the ones replacing Renteria. The Blackhawks won three recent Stanley Cups and McDonough was held accountable. Gar / Pax left with a winning cumulative record, and some playoff success (and executive of the year honors) Maddon won a World Series and was let go three seasons later. Meanwhile Kenny "One Shining Moment" Williams is entering a third decade in a senior role, Don Cooper will die (could be dead already) as pitching coach, and Rick Hahn has zero winning seasons, whether "trying" or "tanking". Time to clean house from top to bottom, though unlikely to happen with Reinsdorf's group. Must be nice to screw up your job and write yourself a five year extension "plan", and then blame others when your draft selections and free agent signings have failed on a consistent basis, with success limited to tanking trades netting people drafted by others and Cuban signings, now restricted with the rule changes / spending caps.

We’re going to make the playoffs, but with this pitching staff, we arent going to go very far.

I'll never forget the 1969 Mets. In mid season Ron Santo ran his big fat stupid mouth off and started trash talking about the Mets. Santo said the Mets infield belonged in Tacoma. (At that time Tacoma had a minor league team) A few weeks later the Mets started winning and the Cubs started losing.The Mets wound up beating out the Cubs by 8 games. At the end of the 1969 season Seaver called Santo "Pizza Man". That nickname stuck with Santo the rest of his career.

This is where talent evaluation and scouting comes into play beyond just a debut professional baseball stat line. This line really doesn't have anything to do with my post, though. I never ignored his ability. I must have done an absolutely horrid job of explaining my viewpoint if all you got from my reply was "Hey, here's his OPS in A ball. Kid stands next to no chance right now!". I apologize. What we’ll likely see is him taking quality at bats from day 1... making solid contact, showing spurts of his potential, along with some Mazara like periods of struggle. I would probably agree with this assessment. My point of contention is with the posts alluding to "Stop everything! Bring him up! Hit him 3rd! Play him at a position he's never played! He's the answer to everything!". That’s worst case. No... no, no, no. Lol. Come on, we've all been watching this game for a while on this forum. Talented prospects with a lot more time to develop than Vaughn has had come up and totally lay an egg ALL OF THE TIME. That includes guys who eventually figure it out, too. I would say your description is "most probable outcome" within the range of potential outcomes. Not the "worst case scenario". It’s not going to be as gloomy as you make it out should he be here in 2020... but it’s not likely to be roses all the time as well. I am sorry, but with respect, I am very confused. I feel like we're not that far apart - yet you keep attempting to paint my post as doom and gloom for Vaughn if he came up. I explicitly and clearly said "I would like to see him come up and get a shot". Why would I say that if I didn't think he had a chance to help out?

Tom Seaver was like Mark Buehrle. Smooth although he did throw harder than Mark. Seaver was so good even in his advanced age he was damn effective for the White Sox. Rest in peace. He was a true star.

3 holes in the rotation has destroyed the pen. It’s obvious.

Maybe I'm a meatball, but does a dude that's never hit above A ball need to be inserted into the 3 hole right away?

It's complicated. I generally prefer upside. Others aren't like that though. Looking at the glut of outfielders that the Sox had for example, I always preferred Luis Gonzalez to Blake Rutherford and Steele Walker because I was confident that Gonzalez could stay in CF and that makes him more valuable than a corner only guy. I usually only rank relievers that can be high leverage guys. The Sox system is weird though. We have some writers who think it makes more sense to put Ian Hamilton or even like Will Kincanon at the back end of the list but I'd much prefer an 18 year old catcher that mashed in the DSL. Proximity to majors matters for me too though. I would probably trade Jonathan Stiever before I'd trade Matthew Thompson but I rank Stiever higher because he's closer to the majors. It honestly just depends. My personal list went out for Patreon subscribers today. I put Jake Burger at #14. I had him at #30 in the preseason. Him being healthy and me seeing him personally in Schaumburg a few weeks back was a game changer for me.