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Bold statement.

So does this all mean if the Sox would have signed Machado they would be doing what the Cubs are doing now? JR should really sell the team if he can’t compete financially. Talk about sustained success and multiple championships is cheaper than him.

Why is it disappointing? The Sox are heavily pursuing Hendriks. You know this already. Who gives a shit what the MLBTR post says?

I'll believe it when it's announced " White Sox have signed Liam Hendriks" and not a minute before that.

Meh. Madrigal > Lux.

That’s right around what the final number will be. I’m not sure why anyone thinks otherwise

No. FIP is an ERA equivalent metrics. Fangraphs even have metrics that compare ERA to FIP called E-F. FIP is meant to take out the components of the ERA that are attributed to balls in play, because hitters and pitchers do not have control over that, and only measures the HR, BB, K, and HBP aspect where the pitchers do have control over, then applying a constant to bring it to the ERA scale. There is another version of this called xFIP, which substitutes the HR pitchers give up with a HR/FB% because HR% should be normalized over time.

I think his name is Greg Amsinger on MLBN. He guarantees the Sox are in the World Series if they signed Yadi. Says he could catch 100 games and they could have Grandal DH .

I would give Collins a Shot. Yeah he hasn't looked good on either end but he only has 120 ABs at the mlb level that is absolutely nothing (for reference Mike trout had a 87 wrc+ his first 135 PAs (no comparison here, I know trout was 18 and had less than 500 PAs above A ball, just to show that sub 300 PAs means nothing) and I do still believe he can be a 110 wRC+ hitter against RHP even if it is a non traditional line (low BA, 20-25 homers, lot of K, tons of walks). I still believe it was a huge mistake to not give Collins 400+ PAs in 2019 when the team was still playing for nothing. They should just have just let him hit everyday and say sink or swim, that way we already would have known him now. I would give him the lefty platoon at DH till may (when vaughn should be up) and after that give him backup catcher.

They sure don't.

Definitely. Him and cliff politee were lights out that year.

Never understood what KW was looking at when he made that trade, but as the Joker would say "Its all part of the plan". Allow me to un-piss you off about that deal: Cotts was as lockdown as you could get out of the pen in 05'. Didn't really factor much in the playoffs, but he did to get to 99 wins.

Meaning that an overpay for JR is different than an overpay for a team like the Yankees who can print money if they’d like. If we overpay and it turns out to be bad JR is gonna try and find a way to pinch pennies on another contract and less likely to commit funds when needed to somewhere else that’s all.

That means nothing. They were also "confident" right before Machado signed with the Padres.

I like Musgrove fine, but no thanks on that.

I would take Musgrove. 1) Three years younger. 2) Has recently put up a 170 inning season (Smyly hasn’t since 2016) and is less likely to tire out over the course of a full season. 3) Better xwOBA in small sample that was 2020 (.268 vs .287). 4) Solid xwOBA in larger sample that was 2019 (.312) while Smyly really struggled (probably due recovering from his injury, but still somewhat a red flag). 5) Higher spin rates / more movement on his breaking balls. I actually think Smyly is a pretty fascinating buy low guy, but I’d definitely have more confidence in Musgrove.

I'm really spooked by rabbits twitter post. I dont like this idea of draining the farm just cause they don't want to spend so if thats the plan to compensate for blowing our wad all on Hendriks then I'd rather pass on Hendriks if that is gonna be what they will do to "buy" a SP and a LH bat. Sounds like there's gonna be no second part of this window. They will clean out the young pitching for 2021-2023. JR and TLR won't be around after that so they don't give a damn about anything after 2023. This is so stupid.

They play that game as a way of slightly lowering the total at the time, expecting that revenues will be higher and so $1 million in 2021 will hurt less than $1 million in 2013. Oops!!

Honestly, I believe the 'best of the rest' after Hendriks is Colome. Too many question marks with Yates, Rosenthal (who I like) and Bradley. If we don't sign Hendriks, I'd be okay with Colome at $7-8M w/option...especially if we use the savings toward the best starter (Q seems like perfect fit). That said, Hendriks is rightfully the priority.

This. As much as I worry about overpaying for a closer, I’m tired of dumpster diving for reclamation projects

100% depends on the price for Musgrove. To be honest, I’m a little worried they spend most of their money on Hendriks and then trade for a cheap C tier starter like Brault. I really want to land Hendriks, but not at the expense of a decent 4th starter.

If you are on base then you should be able to show how an ratio of hr bb and k actually directly shows valid fielding independent pitching results related to runs allowed. You can’t because it doesn’t. You can make all the multi variable equations you want but if the variables don’t equate directly to a unit, then they can’t be reduced to that unit. You can’t prove the hr, bb, k ratio can be reduced to runs and neither can fangraphs. Therefore it can’t be called a measure of runs allowed. That’s why they use terms like assuming and most likely. Comparing two measures of different units is like saying there is a higher lbs/square inch than mph.

i know I've said this before...but a team operating with a stringent payroll limit like the White Sox...needs to be way more insistent on hoarding years of control.

But Joe Musgrove is not Lance Lynn. As we all know, bad starts only don't count when they're made by Lance Lynn, and good starts only don't count when they're made by Joe Musgrove. I'd love to argue against it, but this is just scientifically proven fact.

Easier to handle the stress when you don’t give a fuck about anyone but yourself

It’s ridiculous that they’d be tapped financially. This gives me absolutely zero hope for the future of this team, Jerry won’t do whatever it takes to win a World Series.

If the convert on Hendriks, there is a lot of talk they are about tapped financially but also not done with the offseason. Maybe they ultimately go cheaper on the SP on the FA front, but definitely trade rumors swirling.

Of all the needs Sox have, backup catcher should be at the bottom of the list.

On this we agree. Nothing will change until they improve at tackle. A WR wont make a difference if they QB is running for his life all the time.

All things considered, I'd just as soon have Colome back than Hendricks. Colome isn't as flashy, but he has been very consistent.

Cotts played a huge rule in the WS

I don’t want to draft a 1st round WR ever again. Just lineman, offensive and defensive, 1st 2 rounds, every year, forever. Let’s just dominate the trenches no matter what

I'm the opposite.

Billy Koch was never good.

Not a huge fan of overpaying for a closer, I would prefer we overpay for a game changing starting pitcher. Not hating on the guy just don’t have a warm and fuzzy and could see the money being used elsewhere more productively

If Q is the best we have to look forward to at this point, that is sickening.

Prayers brother.

It’s a back up catcher. They are pretty easy to acquire. If Collins doesn’t work out, he can easily be replaced. You will be able to get a guy like Kevan Smith for a song if need be. Yes, some are far better than others, but most back up catchers are pretty much a pick ‘em.

He is saying that if they are all in than giving Collins a shot doesnt make sense. My point is that the Sox are not all in for this season. They are looking at prolonged success so looking at it from an all in perspective is wrong. Personally I would give Collins a shot as backup and use the resources elsewhere.

Hang in there G man and stay strong.

I am just leery about giving up too much for a guy who never has really done it, and he is 28. Javy Vazquez had one good year with the Sox. It was when the team sucked. He was horrible the other 2 years once when they won 90 games, the other when they won the division, yet had a high WAR. His FIP was almost a full run lower than his actual ERA those seasons, IMO he was not accurately portrayed advanced stats wise. You would never have wanted him starting a must win game. His postseason ERA is over 10.00, yet his k rate is high.Same with Samardzija his lone season with the White Sox. You have to give him credit, he parlayed his football mentality, “young arm”, and advanced stats to 9 figures of earnings. But he was really never much more than mediocre. I wouldn’t give up too much to get Musgrove, but also wouldn’t be surprised if the Sox had a lot of interest. I know when they were shopping Sale and Q, Musgrove was a guy they really liked.

Same. I think Richards has some intriguing upside, but he's the kind of guy you sign to be your ~#7 SP on the depth chart (in theory, obviously you'd start him in MLB if healthy) because he just has zero track record of staying healthy over the past 6 years. Quintana is much more limited but he's a much better fit for a roster that needs another innings eater.

Right, there were more pitchers who weren’t strikeouts guys, but high strikeout pitchers still existed. Koch was not one of them, and even at his highest strikeout rate, he just barely had a 2/1 SO/BB rate (2.02). That’s not good, especially for a reliever. His 1.27 WHIP that season was also far from dominant. Foulke was a more overpowering pitcher sitting in the low 90s. Obviously, I’m still pissed off about this trade, ha.

One of my most hated moments as a Sox fan was when KW non-tendered DJ Carrasco because he was projected to earn $1M in arb. Of all of the cheap and petty moves... It reminds me (given the season) of the time Clark W. Griswold was given a subscription to a jelly-of-the-month club instead of a Christmas bonus he was relying upon to put in a pool. Also reminds me of dumping buyouts recently and using Edwin Jackson to dump Mark Teahen's deal which they had zero reason to offer in the first place.

Damn, was hoping he’d be back as depth for the pen. He really looked good when given the opportunity last year.

While true, there are a lot of dumb and/or uninformed people who will never understand these fucks were trying undermine democracy.

Cardinals playing all these games must have made Musgrove’s pitches spin better and move a lot more.

Almost every pitcher has an injury history though. I mean just looking at the sox giolito, cease, kopech and lynn all had TJ. Which team doesn't have at least two starters who had TJ?

No. All 3 of those pitchers have legitimate injury concerns. It's likely that at least one gets injured. For all the praise they have gotten, they have a very volatile starting rotation.