Leaderboard

Is there any other team in baseball in a worse position than the White Sox? The minor league system is bare. The controlled assets on the main roster are either under performing or sunk costs which means if they do try to sell they will get diminished returns. The payroll is seemingly maxed and the budget is on the way down based on a abysmal 2023 season. They wont ever do what it takes to sign a superstar. They wont hold anyone accountable and in the off chance Hahn is relieved of his duties they wont go outside of the organization to replace him and change the culture. Where is the light at the end of the tunnel?

They just had Season Ticketholder Appreciation Week. They gave them a free bag a popcorn and a discounted ticket to parade around the field one game. If the really appreciated them the week would have looked like this: Monday-fired the hitting coaches Tuesday-fired Ethan Katz Wednesday- fired Pedro Grifol Thursday-fired Chris Getz Friday-fired Rick Hahn Saturday-fired KW Sunday-JR announces he has sold the team That would be appreciation.

Championship quality players. He actually said it with a straight face.

Hahn literally works for the only organization where his ineptitude and poor performance doesn’t cost him his own job. Far far far better GMs have been let go with their worst seasons being Hahn’s best.

Moncada can field and can't hit for power anymore. Anderson can't hit and field anymore. I don't see how these 2 can be traded. I can't believe any other team would want them. The White Sox would get next to nothing for them in a trade. So I'm assuming they won't be traded. Burger should be the every day 3rd baseman now.

We currently have the third worst record in the MLB. I’d have to imagine our farm system is also bottom five. Imagine the incompetence required to have built such a s%*#-show of an organization from top to bottom. Fire this clown before the 4th of July, sell your rentals before the deadline, and then hire Mike Chernoff in the off-season to fix this mess. It really isn’t that hard even if it will take some time to self correct.

This is where I am. The franchise, I think, will be better served by doubling down and failing even harder, so as to increase the chances that it becomes untenable to retain current leadership. We shouldn’t want this group to have any involvement in the next window whatsoever. Unfortunately that may mean digging a deeper and sadder hole that we’ll all have to experience again.

39-34 81-81 23-35 143-150 So since the All Star break in 2021, almost 2 full seasons, the Sox are 7 under, including being mediocre at best for all or parts of 3 straight seasons. What Hahn is clinging to, doesn't exist. It's a bad team. Think what their record would be if they didn't get to play the AL Central so much.

Politicians have been doing this for years. All of them.

This loser answered almost every question with a first word of "look". Always be extremely skeptical of anyone who consistently begins an answer to a question with that word. They are basically implying that you cannot see things for what they truly are. Despite his previous comments, Hahn truly does think he is some sort of king and the smartest guy in the room at all times. The rest of us are merely simple minded peasants who cannot see things that he can.

They should sell ASAP.

I’d be willing to bet that they have a similar result in 2021 with Dunning instead of Lynn. #3 seed, first round exit. If you want the Sox to operate like the Rays, and you want to complain about how there’s no depth to replace injuries, look at all the trades they made where they gave up talent and also took on salary. I come up with half a dozen starting in 2019. Some were good on paper, some were bad on paper, some worked out bad, some worked out good, but the consequence was always loss of depth and less money to spend. That deal type is the opposite of the Rays, the opposite of building depth. They could have overcome that with good drafting or with more spending, but they’ve been bad with both. If you’re going to do deals like that, then either you better win, you better have a reserve to use, or you better be ready to rebuild.

vaughn abreu apr+may may apr apr+may may apr at bats 212 204 average 255 255 211 235 OBP 333 358 276 267 OPS 776 792 536 537 HR 7 4 3 1 1 0 RBI 39 19 20 20 9 11 BB 20 7 13 16 12 4 K 48 24 24 51 24 27 extra base hits 25 12 13 8 4 4 salary - year $760,000 $19,500,000 AV isn't, so far, the player we expected or needed, however it's amazing how much better his numbers are as compared to Abreu - to say nothing of the salary

Chicago White Sox baseball "Playing Below Expectations"™

Hard disagree here. This is a guy coming off a Cy Young worthy season who is controlled for 2 1/2 more years. He would absolutely still return a very nice package if traded now.

He did well on the trades, but I think there’s evidence that even the gems from those deals suffered from the infrastructure they came into. With the one major exception of Giolito* — all of those prospects are, essentially, the same players they were when they were obtained, with the same flaws, just with more experience and practice. If they hadn’t targeted players that were already just a step away from the big leagues, I can’t imagine it would even look like they won those deals. All of the secondary pieces have amounted to the same pile of nothing that every non-first round prospect that Sox have drafted has, and the “no-doubters” have become the talented but frustratingly inconsistent and overall disappointing major leaguers that every first rounder the Sox drafted has. You’re correct to point out that they don’t have the same level of currency to deal from, but ill just add that even if we could be sure that they would get the most fromwhat they have again this time around, I don’t think we want those new players spending even a moment in this toxic farm system. *One could also argue Cease, but until we see evidence that he can reliably harness his command in the long term, I’d argue that the season he had last year was always in the realm of possibility; the result of the stuff he always had plus an extended streak of good location. The type of season that’s a 90+% outcome for a player like him, and every year a handful of players pull out that 90th percentile without necessarily raising their floors.

I just went back and and looked. The Sox were 19-12 their last 31 before the AS break in 2021. That makes them an even 162-162 the last 2 years. Mired in mediocrity.

Ohtani would come here and hit .225/.288/.393 with 2 dongs , all while toting a hefty 6.38 ERA the rest of the way.

Yes, I can imagine 2022.

yeah he isn't saying anything new here, I feel like Sox fans are about to enter a level of baseball hell that we've yet to experience, I'm talking KC/Pittsburgh/Cincy-esque levels of frustration, continuous calls to the score/ESPN that are reminiscent of Berto last month At least with KW, we never felt totally out of it in April, but it's coming

New ownership is the light. And it will happen eventually. Just take care of yourself and hope to be around to see it.

Can Soxtalk be better than this?

I feel like a lot of people on this board are still waiting for them to flip a switch. face it, it's over the sooner you realize it, the less upset you'll be everytime they lose and you won't be asking "How could this happen?"

Without KW and Paddy, we wouldn't have had either Abreu or Luis Robert in the first place. Imagine the franchise without those two over the last decade...

Nobody's trading a lot for a fluke season that was driven by stranding runners on base and a low BABIP/HR rate. Cease's career ERAs: 2019: 5.79 2020: 4.01 2021: 3.91 2022: 2.20 2023: 4.88 One of these things is not like the other; one of these things does not belong. Cease's fastball is down a full mph and his walk rate is even worse than last year.

Even better: White Sox baseball, our expectations were low, but holy s%*#.

But no team is going to give you that at the trade deadline if he is still showing a decreased fastball and dramatically worse performance. You can ask for that all you want and teams will just look elsewhere. You cannot make other teams do things that are bad for them just because you want them to, they will either expect him at a huge discount compared to what he would have returned last offseason or they will just find other options. The only way he is worth that "Very nice package", anything that would really help the White Sox, is if he finds a groove very soon. He certainly could, but teams will only give up multiple top prospects for him if he does so. Right now, he doesn't help me win a title the way he's performing.

The problem is he couldn’t build a team around those guys even though they were playing for peanuts. He did a great job getting them signed, no question. Their surplus value got him more prospects who he couldn’t build around either. There seems to be a pattern.

Dylan Cease should not be a guy the White Sox trade this season given his current performance, as no one will give up what it should take to get him - multiple top 100-ish prospects. Let's look at why. Dylan Cease's FIP this year is 4.4, his expected ERA based on stat cast is 4.63, his 4.88 ERA isn't out of line with that. His K-rate/9 of 9.77 is well down from the 11.1 last year and the 12.28 in 2021. His walk rate is his worst since 2020. The average exit velocity he has given up is the worst of his career. His fastball is down a full 1 mph from last year. Furthermore, last year his fastball started poorly but improved a lot by May, this year May was not obviously better than April. Right now, the White Sox would ask for a very high price for Dylan Cease, and anyone asking about him would expect to get him at a massive discount because not only is his ERA bad but the underlying numbers also suggest that he's not a very good pitcher. This could of course change if he were to pick up his velocity and find a groove over the next 2 months, but right now, Dylan Cease will not return anything of substantial value because he's not a particularly strong pitcher. If he doesn't find a groove very soon, then holding onto him through 2024's trade deadline and hoping for better results with a different pitching coach seems like the appropriate strategy. If Cease does find a groove, then the White Sox will win a couple more games and that will be all Hahn needs to justify that "If we keep playing like this we'll be right there at the end" (Rick Hahn, 2015).

June 1, 1914 - Talk about an impressive beginning to a baseball career. Future Sox Hall of Famer Urban “Red” Faber started for the first time in the big leagues, on this day, in Detroit. He’d go 12 and a third innings before losing 2-1. He gave up 11 hits and walked seven Tigers yet wiggled himself out of most jams. He didn’t give up his first run until the 11th inning. June 1, 1937 - Sox pitcher Bill “Bullfrog” Dietrich hurled a no-hitter at the expense of the St. Louis Browns. He won the game, played in Comiskey Park, 8-0. The game took less than two hours to play. Dietrich got run support from both Mike Kreevich and Fred “Dixie” Walker who each knocked in three runs on the afternoon. Dietrich walked two and struck out five. First baseman Henry “Zeke” Bonura saved the no-hitter with two leaping catches of line drives hit by the Browns during the game. June 1, 1985 - Carlton Fisk slammed his fifth home run in four games when he hit a two-run shot off the Royals Bret Saberhagen in a game the Sox won 8-7. Fisk drove in 12 runs in that stretch and served notice that 1985 was going to be his best year in a Chicago uniform. He’d finish the year with 37 homers and 107 RBI’s, both career highs. He also was named to the All-Star team that year for the third time in a White Sox uniform. June 1, 2016 – It had been 50 years since a White Sox pitcher had this happen to him. In the top of the 13th inning in New York against the Mets, relief pitcher Matt Albers led off with a ringing double to left center, the first extra base hit of his career. He’d eventually come around to score the game winning run later that frame thanks to a sacrifice fly from Jose Abreu. The Sox won the game 2-1 with Albers throwing two innings to get the win. The last time a White Sox pitcher scored the game winning run and got the win in extra innings was Bob Locker against the Angels on August 7, 1966. The Sox won that game in 10 innings 9-8.

We had weekend season tickets that year, and several of us in our section were given boxes of all star ballots each game to just punch Fisk. We booed Tony La Russa every time he emerged from the dugout, and gave up our tickets after the season primarily because Tony was not fired. I started working at Comiskey Park and elsewhere for Andy Frain in 1986.

"Premium Talent"

Just read this article; Each organization's best pick from the 2018 MLB Draft It sums up everything about the Front Office and scouting of this organisation. It identifies Nick Madrigal as our best pick from the 2018 Draft, when we were supposed to be stocking up on top talent during the rebuild that would bring 'years of challenging for success'. Madrigal the top White Sox pick was sent down to AAA last week by the Cubs. And what did that top pick bring the White Sox? Half a season of Madrigal, then a trade for Kimbrel, who achieved nothing, who was traded for Pollock , who achieved nothing. So the top pick in 2018 brought the White Sox nothing. But it doesn't stop there apart from Romy Gonzalez not one of the 2018 Draft is currently on the MLB squad, and none of the rest are anywhere near contributing or are still at the Sox. So all in all the 2018 Draft was a complete waste for the Sox either through bad scouting, bad player development or a combination of the two.

I didn't expect anything from this interview, much less Hahn taking blame for anything. I no longer expect anything from the White Sox organization, and that includes a World Series in the near future.

They didn't do the necessary groundwork back in 2016 either and here we are... Definition of insanity.

Drafting guys in the top 5 who can barely clear the fences with a metal bat during batting practice is not something you should ever do.

58 games is a good indicator of how things will be. Baseball is a weird game, and many things can happen. Fans can hope if they want, but I don't anticipate great things for this team. They have too many games like the last one against the Angels.

Ok congrats Hahn, you got this one correct letting Abreu go and keeping Vaughn. A broken clock is always correct at least twice a day. So occasionally you can get one right. The fact still remains your resume of scouting, drafting, developing prospects, trading players, FA signings, etc., is complete horsesh*t and you need to be fired sooner than later.

Lynn needs to wear it. Leave him in 5-6 innings each game, even if he gives up 10 runs a game for the rest of the season, or until he hits the IL for the third straight season. No need to waste the bullpen. leave them for the four other games through the rotation the Sox have a chance. Lynn is always quick to point at other players on the field, blaming teammates and third base coaches just like Dallas Keuchel. At least Dallas didn't cost the Sox one of the few solid pitching prospects over the past decade. Speaking of the other one, Hahn doesn't offer Carlos Rodon a QO, but pays these two on their final MLB deals $100M and doubled down on the Kimbrel debacle.

Neither Sosa nor Colas were obtained by the 2018 MLB draft. It seems extremely odd to bring them up as examples of why we shouldn’t be down on that draft yet.

The amount of games the last couple seasons that were basically over after the 1st inning reminds me of the James Shields era.

The Sox have had many bad seasons over the years, but only four teams 12 + games under .500 entering June. 2023 23-35 2018 16-37 (62-100) 1989 18-33 (69-92) 1948 9-26 (51-101-2) Please fire Rick Hahn to kick off June, and give White Sox fans hope for the future.

May should've been a relatively easy schedule. No excuse not going 18-11 minimum. Dropping 3 of 4 vs KC and 3 of 4 vs Detroit really killed it. Not to mention playing to lose on the last game against Minnesota when they could've swept them.

Neither Madrigal nor Vaughn fits the ideal profile for a top ten pick. They lack, as Ryan Poles would say, outstanding traits. The difference is Vaughn is a year younger and still in the majors. The chances that Madrigal reaches his ceiling of "David Fletcher 2" are rapidly dwindling. For Vaughn, while there's life, there's hope.

You could argue he loses all 6 of those games in emphatic fashion.

https://aweu.info/unknown-red-sox-prospect-appears-to-be-rising-star-after-masterful-chaim-bloom-trade-bbb?fbclid=IwAR17OCxsqUeHZaqnRgDNZQ998xVeKMksFrG6OUOjwEYJWGjPbRKYDH_2J2A_aem_th_AbrLNak-J9nfojPnaohXcspSf9JBl_GpwUfDt5qIRFbcIYoDPiG8PCDs4BFSS0pQfWM&mibextid=Zxz2cZ Theo Delinger-Another example of poor player development and other teams being able to identify players to snag away.

For a chance at the World Series many teams do it though. In that context it wasn't all that risky. Giolito was in his 3rd season of getting Cy Young votes. After that he fell off . Cease was improving. Kopech was injured but was expected to be a high quality starter. We all know that the Sox have made that same mistake in years that they were mediocre. Samardzija, Bassitt, James Shields and in that context it is far worse. You cannot predict the future with youth. Dunning might look good ATM for his 12 appearances (8 in relief) but who knows how he'll do as as starter the rest of the year and in 24 and 25. If we look at all the injuries that doomed the Sox as well as the lack of depth at all levels Dunning wouldn't have helped the Sox contend in 2022 or 2023 and what he does going forward is a mystery. We can't talk about him now as if he's an All Star. He's not and he may never be. Fine depth for a contender like the Rangers With Dunning and without Lynn there's no playoffs in 2021 . If they weren't developing youth and kept every prospect they're likely still mediocre . Trades must be made at some point . I've long been saying the Sox have need to start getting more, youthful and operate more like Tampa Bay. We can't wish it into existence. Jerry and Hahn do what they do and we know what the usual results are. Crying about not having Dunning now is pure hindsight. At the time many thought it was a great trade for the "window".

He was 4-5 with a 5.83 ERA.

I'd pay to listen to Steve Stone read our mean posts.