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Crochet has thrown 19 innings since 2021 (and he only threw 54 in 2021) and can't stay healthy. He isn't going to be in the Sox starting rotation next year. He needs to build innings.

Detroit pizza is so damn good. The main reason I give tavern style the victory is that Detroit style is a "mood" kinda thing. Can't eat it all the time because it's so dense and cheesy - like deep dish & stuffed. Detroit style is also my favorite style to make. Got a special pan for it and everything.

1. Thank you for listing Tavern Cut as the representative Chicago pizza. 2. If you haven't already, please consider Buddy's Pizza before judging. Or Grandma Bob's (in Corktown near old Tiger Stadium).

Tale of the Tape: Ownership: Both Suck. Chris Illitch brought payroll from Top 5 (2012-2017) under father to Bottom 10-12 ($197M 2017; $80M-$135M since). Jerry is worse, but hopefully Jerry’s tenure is shorter and his children do not take over. Front Office: Detroit. Scott Harris hired in 2022 from San Francisco. Jerry hired the guy he likes to watch games with, has no credentials or experience. All stated knowledge comes from sitting with Pedro and running a failed player development program. Manager: Detroit. Reinsdorf blocked Hinch, hired DUI guy. Keeping Pedro Grifol because cheap and baseball stupid. Team: Detroit. Detroit holds a 9 1/2 game lead in the standings, 4-6 lead in the season series. Sox need a series sweep to win the season series. Pizza: Chicago! Tavern Cut > Detroit Style Anywhere > Little Caesars White Sox Season Series Won or Possible Series Wins: (Remaining Games, Required Minimal Record) Arizona 0-0 (3 home 2-1) Atlanta 2-1 Boston 2-1 (3 away 2-1) Cincinnati 2-1 Cleveland 8-5 Detroit 4-6 (3 away 3-0) Kansas City 5-5 (3 home 2-1) Minnesota 3-6 (4 home 4-0) New York Yankees 4-2 San Diego 0-0 (3 home 2-1) Washington 0-0 (3 away 2-1)

I doubt it Getz any better.

The problem with Kopech is he can't throw strikes. How does making him a reliever fix that problem?

Maybe he would greatly benefit health wise from having the daily routine of a starting pitcher rather than the volatile routine of a relief pitcher. Only one way to find out.

....so will he be penciled in as the #2 or #3 starter to open 2024, then?

Most. Kind of like how the Sox are trash, but they're still better than most minor league teams. They're more expensive, though.

Sadly the Sox will become like the Detroit Lions were for me during the Millen to Patricia regimes, which was just something I followed mostly to laugh and shake my head. As a huge Lions fan growing up the team just became so painfully awful year after year after year that there was absolutely no point in fandom. Once you get into your 30s your teams really do need to be good once and awhile. When you're younger hope can sustain your fandom but that runs out after awhile. I'm not going to follow the Sox' offseason. I'm not going to bother with a spring training trip or buying tickets for when they come out here. I'll just follow them at arm's length like I did the Lions and if they ever get new management (like the Lions) that proves they know a little about winning I'll start following more closely again. It's not being a bandwagon fan it's just realizing that rooting for a bottom 1/3 club for a decade isn't rewarding, and in some cases can actively impact your real life attitude -- that's when it gets too much. Getting angry or sad about these sad sack franchises just isn't it.

I am glad to see we are finally rubbing the Dodgers off of him and he's really learning how to be a White Sox now.

i had season tickets for 30 years or so. I've seen a lot of bad baseball. But I always stayed for the whole game, even when it was hopeless, even when James Shields gave up 7 runs in the first inning. But starting last year, there was just something different about this awfulness. i would leave games in the 5th inning. I didn't renew my tickets. That turned out to be a good move. It was even worse this year. I still want them to win, but knew this season was over in April. They don't want to throw us a bone, and commit to being good. JR said hiring Getz was for the fans. If the fans had a say, Chris Getz would not be working for the White Sox in any role. More of the same. I wish MLB owners would put some pressure on JR to sell. This is a huge market. He is turning a lot of people away from baseball.

Of course he will be because it's a contract year for him, then once he has a new contract secured he'll be back to looking at strike 3.

The Kopech, Crochet, Lambert, Bummer, Santos bullpen next year is gonna lock s%*# down!

Not sure if it's my health issues, or the fact that this organization is dead in the water and sinking by the bow, but for the first time in my life I really have no interest in watching the White Sox . I have them on like always, but mostly ignore it, while i'm paying attention to the Marlins broadcast, which I have much more interest in now . wondering if this is going to be it for me as a Sox fan, or if the interest will return . it's very weird and depressing.

I really don't enjoy being an overly pessimistic person, but man I can't shake the feeling that we whiffed hard on Gonzalez. Bleh.

From DVS story tonight in the Sun-Times. Have the Sox seen enough of his struggles? Sox probable starters for the weekend series in Detroit list Saturday as TBD in Michael Kopech’s turn. Kopech (5.31 ERA) has walked 31 batters and allowed 24 earned runs in his last 28 1⁄3 innings over seven starts. He was pulled from his start Sunday after recording just five outs and walking five batters. “We’re still in the process of communicating, not with Kopech, but as an organization, to see what we’re going to do,” Grifol said. “Why? That’s going to stay internal.” Story also said Crochet started another rehab assignment in Birmingham.

Here is "midseason" top 30 prospects list: https://www.futuresox.net/2023/09/07/futuresox-2023-midseason-chicago-white-sox-top-30-prospect-list/

Lions are so underrated. I still think the Vikings will win the division but I'll gladly argue the Lions are the most talented team in the division. Their o-line, defense and Goff is solid enough, can manage a game. Their only downfall will be the "Lions are gonna Lions" if they are not gonna choke down the stretch which they've done for years.

Truth be told, I’ve never turned away any pizza. The worst pizza I’ve ever had was still edible. As for frozen pizzas, just gimme a Jack’s. Not as filling as I’d like, but still my favorite. If you guys are close to the park (though probably not at a game), gotta get yourselves a Phil’s. Make sure it’s well done. I’d strongly suggest beef and bacon, or beef and sausage. Get giardiniera on both.

The best game threads happen in days without a game

Can't remember if I tried Vito & Nicks frozen or not. Don't remember ever seeing it. Grew up in Oak Lawn though so we would go to the one on Pulaski a lot.

Fair enough. Personally Vito & Nick's on Pulaski is my favorite non-Neapolitan pizza in the world. I just wanted to make sure Detroit wasn't being punished for giving the world Little Caesar's. I can't even call that s%*# "pizza."

💯 this regarding Keynan Middleton, who just joined Liam on the IL. https://nypost.com/2023/09/06/yankees-put-keynan-middleton-on-il-in-latest-bullpen-blow/

Coming off the worst season in my lifetime (32 years old), not a lot. No hope for next year.

Tanking trades remaining players: Cease Age 27, 1.0 bWAR Kopech 27, 0.9 Jimenez 26, 0.3 Moncada 28, 0.2

Don't forget Shaw with 130 appearances. (Seriously I actually hope they bring him back. Much needed leader in the pen. Imagine Kopech crying about pitching too much in front of him)

September 7, 1954 - One of the lynchpins of the famed Sox pitching staff of the late 1950's, Dick Donovan was acquired from Atlanta in the minor leagues. Dick would win 73 games in six seasons on the South Side including a pair of one-hitters and be named to the All-Star team in 1955. September 7, 1960 - In a game at Comiskey Park infielder Sammy Esposito booted a cinch double play ball hit by future Sox infielder Bill “Moose” Skowron, with the Sox leading in the eighth inning, 4-2. That lead quickly evaporated as the Yankees rallied for four runs and a 6-4 win. Willie Harris and his friend, Jesse James (I swear I'm not making the names up) had a wager on the game. When Esposito blew the ground ball Harris took matters into his own hands. He jumped over the box seat railing, ran on to the field, had words with the player then the two started throwing punches. It took several uniformed police officers and ushers to pull Harris off of Esposito. Harris left the field shouting that he was “A real Sox fan.” September 7, 1970 - The White Sox were swept by the A’s in a Monday doubleheader at Comiskey Park, in front of 6,115 fans. As the losses dropped Chicago to 49-92 on the season, the sweep was not remarkable. But what was? With September’s expanded rosters, the Pale Hose used 13 players and five pitchers in the 7-4 opening loss, and 16 players and seven pitchers in the 7-5 nightcap loss. The 41 total players in a doubleheader set a Major League record for the time (it has since been broken.)

Started the game thread because, unlike this team, we show up for every game. How will they lose today?

The White Sox are going to be a much better organization now that they have a GM who will let the scouts do their job instead of one who thought his computer was smarter than they are.

The Kopech situation has been mishandled from day one. Might as well keep him for now because the staff is so depleted. He can't be expected to be part of the rotation next year.

I didn't watch the game. I was half-contemplating turning it on when my daughter called and said she had a flat tire. Since changing a tire in a Ross parking lot could be more fun than watching a Sox game, I ran out the door. Moncada looks like a different player, more like the 2021 version. Maybe he's finally healthy. This Yoan Moncada will be nice to have around in 2024, and with it being his last year before potential free agency, he could have a nice season. It's good to see Vaughn hitting better. His average is trending upward, and he's had some impressive home runs. Figuring Toussaint will be part of the rotation next season, it's nice to see him have a decent outing. He's got great stuff. If he can get better control, he could be a pretty good starting pitcher.

Trade is such a bad word for this organization. While fans of other teams that are not habitual losers can talk as if they're solutions, for the Sox it just takes suck to a new level.

One owner hires quality baseball executives based on industry qualifications, gives them an annual budget, and lets them spend how they, as professionals, see fit. The other is Constanza, does the complete opposite, yet acts as though he is superior and his 29 fellow owners are rubes. Jerry knows more Brooklyn Dodgers than he does White Sox, but sadly he won't implement Branch Rickey's saying he made famous on the South Side "Luck is the residue of design." (OG quote by John Milton).

Bummer is awful and has been for a few years. "Bad luck" my ass.

I was furious at the pick but to be fair have mentioned that many times since and admitted I was wrong. Like I said he was close to becoming the only player on the team that for me was likeable. I was close to being a Burger enthusiast. ... Moving him to second was such a joke. It shows you partly how the inmates run the asylum so to speak. I'm assuming they didn't want to anger Moncada by moving him to 2B even though that woulda made for a "decent" infield lineup. Burger, TA, Moncada and Vaughn is not the worst infield in the majors. Moncada, TA, Burger and Vaughn is laughable.

I see the Royals scored in the 8th so I figured Bummer must've come in and I see by the box score that yep it was Bummer.

Seby is a D-Back

Shouldn't he know? I mean, in theory, he was in charge of that sort of thing, at least up through the minors.

Boy, you sure are quick to write off Eder since you once called Burger a "wasted first round pick." But don't worry - you're not the only one in that thread calling him a bust. @Lip Man 1 joins you, plenty of @Harold's Leg Lift ragging on the guy. @greg775 repeatedly asks what the hell were the Sox thinking by drafting him. Burger was truly the worst pick ever, until he wasn't. Really, the only person adamant that the pick was good/solid was @Y2Jimmy0.

It was 2011. Around that time The Hangover came out and "Paging Dr. F*ggot" was a big joke in it. Times change. Bringing this up now is stupid.

Not George Armstrong Custer?

Steve Harwell, lead singer of Smash Mouth, 56

At my age, i'm used to seeing names of people that are familiar pass away to somewhere, if indeed anywhere, but this one hurts . I lived in Key West for over 10 years, back in the 70' & 80's . since I worked on a commercial longline boat, we saw Jimmy's sailboat often tied up, not far from us, over at the navy base, where they used to let us dock . we saw him often when he was home, and I was at a party at his house once, and once just sitting having drinks at the Pier House, he walked in with his guitar, went up on stage and played a bit . no one knew he was coming and it was amazing . I loved all of his songs . he brought more to people than can be imagined, was an amazing musician, and person, and will be missed by many, including me.

No offense but I have a hard time rooting for cubs. I was happy for all my cub loving friends when they won the WS but other than that, its not in my DNA to pull for them

Little Caesar's is trash, but its still better than most frozen pizzas and it's cheaper too.