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My main and consistent beef with this org is the complete lack of emphasis on player development. Prior to Project Birmingham last year (note - is that still even a thing?) I've never once seen any evidence of the organization drafting, fostering, and growing talent in a way that grooms players to make the most of their skills and improves on their weaknesses to a point where they can't be consistently exploited (I'm looking at you, slider-chasers... aka our entire fucking lineup). I don't know if it's an edict on JR's part NOT to put resources into minor leagues. I don't know if it's Hahn's decision to direct resources away from the minor leagues / player development budget... or if it's Hahn's lack of foresight to develop and execute a cohesive player development strategy. Fact is, we can sit here and cry foul about payroll caps, but we can also point to teams like Oakland, Tampa, Cleveland, and Minny who consistently churn out quality players who they can sell at peak value to restock their farm system. Yes - JR is a shitty owner, but, unless there's some top-down edict saying that no player development should take place, Hahn has clearly shown that he's just a s%*# GM who doesn't know how to build a winning team. I will argue up and down that he inherited a s%*# team / s%*# core / s%*# farm system and that any sensible GM would have had to rebuild when he did, but what he's shown since the 2021 trade deadlines (note: I was in favor of the Kimbrel trade that turned out horrendous) is that he is in over his head. ...and if JR IS hamstringing him on the farm system? It's the job of executives to manage upwards and convince those above them that a change in strategy is needed. Hahn has clearly failed at that, too.

Words cannot describe how furious, frustrated, sad and fed up I am right now. I look forward to every season, now I have to go through this one and wait 6,7 years more to maybe enjoy baseball again. I'm so Fucking tired of Reinsdorf' bullshit. Fucking tired of incompetence Hahn Fucking sucks as a GM. The whole Fucking org is a joke. It's full of people screwed into there seats. They should be called Congress. People screwed into there seats that know they ain't gonna be held accountable. It's a joke. This dude has had this franchise hand tied for 43 years. It's insane. I gotta stay away for a bit. This team don't deserve my time or any of you guys either. We should all just gather so Reinsdorf can just insult us and slap us in the face. Reminds me of the last 15 yrs the buffalo bills were owned by Ralph Wilson. f*** this guy. Seriously

No Jon, this should read TLR wasn't the White Sox *only* issue in 2022. Let's not let anyone whitewash how awful TLR was, how he was always the wrong fit, and how poor a decision it was to drag is pickled corpse out of retirement. Brining him back set the franchise back, but so did the decision to go backwards by hiring him. He was catastrophically bad, but was also a symptom of the greater illness.

I struggle with the notion in the first video that the Sox FO and ownership finds losing a preferable outcome. I get it, because they don’t open the purse strings to $300 million players. But I think it’s worse; the Sox have been trying to win, but have been incompetent in assembling the veteran pieces, some starting pitching, and bullpen to compliment the young core of this roster. They set so much money on fire.

Smart teams bid adieu to the Lance Lynn's and fill the void from their player development stockpile. Dumb teams sign the Lance Lynn's because they don't have a clue what player development is. Sorry Lance, that I had to use you as an example.

I’ll give it a try for the first time this season….Let’s get this thing moving in the right direction. A vote for Pedro is a vote for all! LFG! Lynn vs Bassitt

I'm just continually amazed how awful this is. To be worse in your "window" than when you were "tanking." And we seem to be the only ones who care.

Yup agree. All this BS talk like they know what's going on inside every players head and have this effort meter they shine on the players so they know it's not there is ludicrous. Despite losing 3 in a row against TB . I saw progress. TB was 10-0 at home. The Sox got them into the 9th with a lead and they went 10 before losing. They were averaging 7 runs a game. Sox held them under that. The BP has been pitching better . TB leads baseball in team ERA and Sox gave them games in 2 of the 3. The problem is always and always will be perception. Losing always equals lack of mental and physical effort in a fan's head especially on a team that we all perceive as lacking in many departments like player development, scouting and coaching. There are many many people involved in the product on the field and the results ( wins and losses ) are a collective result of many different people not standing between the white lines.

The TLR gaslighting this weekend into Monday is amazing. 1. Rick Hahn should have been let go in 2015 after not being able to handle the La Roche situation, and certainly after 2016 after one of the worst four years in White Sox history. 2 TLR was a bad hire and never should been considered for the job. 3. Jerry was the reason TLR was hired and Hahn remains. #Facts

Should I change the title to “Moncada to probably miss most of the rest of his career” ?

Schooled is a great term for how the Rays took all three from the Sox. You're not kidding with a fraction of the Sox salary. The Rays starting lineup from yesterday's game: 1. Yandy Diaz 1B - $6,000,000 2. Wander Franco SS - $2,454,545 3. Randy Arozarena LF - $4,150,000 4. Brandon Lowe 2B - $5,250,000 5. Harold Ramirez DH - $2,454,545 6. Issac Paredes 3B - $735,000 7. Luke Raley RF - $722,300 8. Christian Bethancourt C -$1,350,000 9. Manuel Margot CF - $7,000,000 Zach Eflin SP - $11,000,000 Rays other SP's Shane McClanahan - $737,000 Drew Rasmussen - $739,700 Taj Bradley - $720,000 Kevin Kelly - $720,000 Tyler Glasnow - 15 Day IL - $5,350,000 Rays bullpen used during 3 game Sox sweep Cooper Criswell - $720,000 Garrett Cleavinger - $725,000 Jason Adam - $1,775,000 Colin Poche - $1,175,000 Yonny Chirinos - $1,275,000 Jalen Beeks - $1,375,000 Pete Fairbanks - $3,666,666 That my Sox friends is the blueprint for an organization that completely understands and implements how a baseball team should properly Scout, Draft, Sign FA's, Make solid trades and most importantly, DEVELOP talent in their farm system. They have been doing this for the last 15 years in arguably the toughest division in baseball. It is so damn irritating our Owner and FO don't have an ounce of a F*^king clue to this blueprint concept.

I love how arguments get switched to defend Hahn. When we called Jerry cheap, the "high payroll" was used to defend him and the team. Now that Hahn's rear is to the fire and fans are holding him accountable for poor resource allocation of that "high payroll", it has turned into financial constraints limiting large contracts. I don't feel sorry for Hahn and his arrogant and condescending ass. He had plenty of money to work with and decided to spend it all on a crap bullpen, DK, Pollock, etc. Let's not forget we tanked to get the 4th overall pick which he drafted a guy with no power with. And then traded the player for Kimbrel and Pollock. This man literally threw a tank season out of the window. The clown also let Rodon walk for nothing when it was clear he wasn't going to sign the QO.

Its so embarassing to be a fan of this franchise. Everyone in the seats should have a bag over their head at the next home stand. Can't say anything else that hasn't already been said. Just struggling to find any reason to care about the Sox.. didn't feel this way in any previous season no matter how bad they got.

Not sure this year's team was ever highly rated... but your overall point remains perfectly valid.

I’m easily going to watch less Sox baseball this year than any season the past 3 decades. There’s truly nothing interesting about this team/organization.

Maybe they have one but aren’t executing, but it sure looks like most of these guys don’t have a plan when they come to bat. I am not too impressed with the new hitting coach yet.

It just seems almost everyone they call up has a baseball IQ like they were just shown the sport the week prior.

They’re going to have to fire someone in the next 7-10 days if this goes the way it seems. I’m thinking Katz or Hahn.

The Chicago White Sox organization from top to bottom have a very poor baseball IQ and have been for a number of years. Until Anderson comes back they will struggle to score runs not because Anderson is that awesome but his replacement always seem to arguably be the worst play in baseball. Last year it was Leury. This year it is Romy Sosa.

On this day in 2023. Lance Lynn talks like a tough guy after getting shelled in yet another White Sox loss.

You don't want public ownership. You want some rich person who can't possibly spend all of their money, but is competitive as hell, and not so concerned with winning the battle for the biggest profit.

Moncada to probably miss breaking pitches

The very worst thing that happened to us as fans long term was that the Sox FO luckboxed their way into a fluke 2005 World Series win. That win was brought to you by an insane number of career years and everything working out injury wise and budget wise just right, and gave everyone involved the confirmation bias they needed to justify their idiotic business model for the rest of time because against all sense, logic, and reason, it worked exactly once. The White Sox are the Chris Moneymaker of MLB.

He has?

Many years ago George Weiss was the Yankees GM. He created a dynasty with the Yankees in the 1940s-1950s. Nobody liked him but the Yankee owners didn't care. Weiss did his job very well and wound up in the MLB HOF. I knew some people who worked for the White Sox who liked Himes. Fact is JR didn't like him so Himes lost his job. He now has Hahn as his GM simply because he likes him. Hahn has been a terrible GM just as JR has been a terrible owner. They both deserve each other.

I just read more Hahn speak prior to the season. My favorite quotes were: "Jose Ruiz looked great for Venezuela and we are excited." "Lynn dominated for team USA, that is a great sign." "We want to prove we are the team from 2020 and 2021, and not 2022." (lol Rick these seasons weren't THAT good) "We have something to prove and hold ourselves accountable."

Do you think Tampa Bay would be bad with the Sox roster? No way to know for sure, but I think they would be very very good. Like dude said, it's an infrastructure problem first and foremost.

Nothing helps more than knowing we all feel the same about this team (for the most part, with some exceptions) Posting some podcasts/videos of other Sox fans rant/vent about what's happening, how we got here, nailing down exactly what the problems are, etc Watching these were cathartic for me personally (I posted this in the game thread but we close those so) Feel free to post your own videos/interviews that reflect what we are feeling right now. ?

I mean obviously nobody could've for-seen that. But should the closer really have the 3rd highest AAV on the team? Just saying they spent a lot of money doesn't mean they've spent it wisely.

Don't tell me what you spent, tell me how you spent it. Like having the most expensive bullpen in MLB that also has the highest ERA. This is from a week ago but I imagine not much has changed since then.

That's the Cleveland way of building a bullpen from within the organization, as opposed to the Hahn way of throwing $$$$$$$$ at Kimbrel, Graveman, and Kelly. We could of had a legitimate second baseman, SP, and a right fielder by now instead of counting on two rookies and Cueto/Clevinger.

As long as I've been on Soxtalk, people have been under this strange delusion that if only the players "gave more effort" or "had passion" (or some similar term) they would be better. Example A: Sox hitter grounds out weakly to the second basemen... Soxtalk Member 1: What a terrible effort. Soxtalk Member 2: What a lazy swing... Sometimes you are just in a slump. And sometimes you just aren't very good... I have a hard time believing that if only we had more passion we would be contenders. Fundamentally the problem is we give up too many walks, and don't take enough ourselves. I don't think passion and effort changes that in a major way.

TLR was bad but this team had zero power last year and a s%*# bullpen. They decided to stand pat at the deadline and thought things would just take off. They refuse to believe these players aren't as good as they thought. Rick Hahn is also the biggest issue with the roster, then Jerry.

If I'm Hahn, I'm out of a job five years ago because of shitty performance.

Diekman:

i'm sure this has been well-covered elsewhere, but by far my biggest beef with hahn is how he squanders the already small resources he has. he came up through this org so he knows as well as anyone that second-place jerry isn't going to give him a big-boy budget. and yet he consistently spends the small amount of money he does have poorly. the bullpen expenditures are mind-numbing when year-in, year-out we see teams create great bullpens out of nothing. there's zero need to make that where all your cash sits. it's just dumb.

Anyone remember the show, “Pimp My Ride”? It later came out that believe it or not the “reality” show was… fake! The cars themselves were not even functional, but they slapped crazy ass things on them to make them “pimped” out. That’s basically the Sox. Lots of fancy/shiny pieces, but the vehicle itself is a POS. Last year you had an old drunk behind the wheel of this monstrosity and this year you have a 15 year old with his drivers permit who doesn’t know how to drive stick shift.

I think a lot of the outrage has to do with coming to terms with the fact that the window of contention ended up being like 1.5 seasons (if we're being generous) and that the future of the org is rather bleak. I'm not sure how that doesn't justify outrage. Also, if the expected outcome of a stretch of games vs contenders is 10-12, I'm not sure that's the sign of a contending team in the first place.

The current draft pool slot system has been in effect since what, 2015 or 2016? And in that time the Sox tanked and had several years worth of high draft picks. Yet in all of that time they still don’t have a competent minor league system producing MLB regulars. Not even superstars, just average major leaguers. Fire the whole fucking front office into the sun already.

Personally, I think "Project Birmingham" was more a publicity stunt than anything else. Their system gets hammered by every evaluator. They do have a few interesting prospects though. I think they wanted to take the emphasis off of how little their system is valued in the industry.

I've never heard anything about mandates during the draft. Obviously Reinsdorf doesn't like signing 14 yr old Latin players but I've never heard him saying they can't draft certain players. Honestly it sounds like something someone would say after the fact to cover their ass. Lots of that going on over there these days.

I said this in another thread, this is the really worrying thing, they are actually trying at the moment and are this bad. At least during the tank seasons under Ricky R. you got the sense they were trying to educate them to do the basics right and he would only accept maximum effort, at the moment they can't even do the basics and look disinterested at best, losing doesn't look like it bothers them that much.

This was only going to go as far as how good the Core would end up being. Bottom line is they were overrated and really average if not bad now that we see the finished product. The bad referring to those that provided nothing at the big league level (Fulmer, Collins, Madrigal, Burdi, Hansen, Adolfo, Basabe, Walker, Gonzalez, etc) And to this very moment, there's a lot of struggling still going on with the top prospects in the organization.

I think we are signing all these has beens to minor deals so they can trade off the team. Not much depth need to rebuild

If I am Hahn, everyone on the 26-man roster is up for grabs for prospects.

The correct and final answer is 3

The post title never really makes it clear which Twins series they were writing about.

This board will be a ghost town in a couple weeks.