Leaderboard

If the first move isn't getting rid of Hahn, literally nothing else matters and you are all setting yourselves up for disappointment yet again.

Lots of players get hurt, all the time. Good teams figured out you have to invest in dealing with that issue about 15 years ago. It’s part free agency, part player development, but it’s an investment that must be made and maintained. The past three years has been a case study on how to waste money gambling. Every significant move they made, big or small, was a risky proposition — and that’s why they were able to make the moves. Signing famous players as they reached the end of their primes, yes does technically add talent to the team, but when you are unwilling or unable to deal with the downside, you’re just torpedoing yourself. I've been among many who have been lambasted for being a doomsayer and too negative on this board for the past few offseasons, but I’m telling you, this s%*# looked bad AS it was happening. This does not require the benefit of hindsight. This roster has every appearance of having been assembled by someone who does not understand what they’re doing; it has some measure of flash, no substance. And it happened in an organizations that has built the most impressively nuclear-fallout proof echo chamber of coaching and player development anyone has ever seen. It’s just, it’s a train wreck. There no other company in America with so much money on the line, that would allow this to continue for so long. It’s total incompetence.

I feel like it's even worse than that, it's when fans were losing their minds, they'd turn on the fans for being irrationally angry and not capable of seeing it objectively.

Still waiting for Stone to be condescending to fans who were right about this team from April on.

I want more blood than this, this offseason, but seems realistic. The new manager needs to run spring training like nothing some of these players have ever seen. The expectations need to be set before they even get there.

Raw talent with no refinement. Bad habits allowed to persist. Lack of leadership to tell players otherwise AND hold them accountable.

I liked the Sox better before they changed the game.

The same man locked out a world series contending team and raised the white flag during a playoff run. I think you over estimate his concern for others thoughts.

Alright guys, Elmo is our GM. He's busted into Preller's stash. Here's the completely unreasonable Off-Season. Trade Eloy for Jazz Chisholm if the medicals clear out. Might need to do a 3-way deal, but when Eloy hustles he gets hurt. A team might buy into his second half. Re-sign Abreu. He's consistent, tries, and is generally that dude. Give Aaron Judge the single fattest contract you could ever fathom. Hell, give him @fathom. Rebuild the Goose Island, but this time the goose is wearing a judge's robe and wig. I know I can get @bmags on board with His Honorable Judge Goose. Jettison Josh Harrison. Same for Engel. Man's no longer got it. Sign Jose Quintana as your swingman. Give Rodon a contract, even though you're gonna get ripped for losing a pick when you could have gained a pick the previous year. Elmo don't f*** around baby. Nuke the coaching staff. Katz can stay due to getting a Cy Young contender annually and some pretty big bullpen wins (Lopez, Lambert, Banks to a degree), but next year he's on the hot seat. Do a full coaching search. Beg Tito. Jirschele can get a look for bench coach depending how he does with the Desert Dogs. Giolito diets with Justin Fields. If Colas tears up Spring Training, he gets LF to start the year. Pollock as 4th OF. Trade Gavin Sheets somewhere for something. Thank him for his service. Lineup: SS - Anderson CF - Robert RF - Judge 1B - Abreu 3B - Moncada DH - Vaughn C - Grandal 2B - Chisholm LF - Colas Bench: PR / Defensive Sub - Leury, unfortunately. Cut if he starts out bad. 4th OF - Pollock C - Seby Zavala INF - Romy/Mendick Rotation: Cease Rodon Lynn Slim Giolito Kopech Bullpen Hendricks Graveman Lopez Bummer Crochet (piggybacking with Kopech) Kelly Diekman Quintana - 6th starter with Martin. Unfortunately, Elmo is not our GM. So most likely: Sign Wil Myers. Sign Michael Fulmer. Miguel Cairo is named manager after no extensive search. Rest of staff remains, including McEwing, Boston and Menechino. "Health got in the way."

Because it’s exactly like something the Sox would do.

Exactly. Speaking of turning on fans, haven't seen Steve Stone's Twitter recently, wonder if he's walked back rhetoric. Doubtful.

Yeah, I mean especially stuff like Ryan McGuffey now going off. That's cool, but you also were calling out fans for being too negative as they were bringing up the problems in real time.

700.

Reinsdorf gonna be pissed if these guys lose hold of 2nd place.

Agreed, give him what he wants. 1 year contract, future opportunities like Kenny had in the FO, perhaps in the dugout or working with Paddy in the Caribbean. A new project like youth player outreach. Give him a year or two space to figure it out. Just keep him involved if he has ANY interest in helping the organization. No player here in my lifetime (50+ years) loved the White Sox as much as Jose has. None.

I've watched very few games this year, and I can't even imagine watching any games next year, I hate damn near everyone on this team minus Abreu, even Cease comes off as a scared little boy in big moments I'll tune in if they fire literally everyone and let someone from outside the org have full control on hiring/firing. otherwise I'll have ample time to find something else to spend time on. I managed this year just fine I'll still wear my Sox gear just to strike up conversations with random people about how much I hate my team ?

The players cared enough to be a very good team in 2020, win the division in 2021 despite countless injuries, but then decided to stop caring this year? I find that very difficult to believe. The organization doesn't put players in the best position to succeed, whether that's in the very lowest levels of the minors or the big league club. Player development, coaching, and the medical staff are all huge areas where the Sox let their players down and don't maximize their ability.

Sox are way, way likelier to go after Conforto than Nimmo, given the costs. It would be so like the Sox to get him, only to see his arm is totally shot and force them to DH him and put Eloy back in the field.

stunning and brave to print these articles now and not you know, in June when it was apparent that the team was basically a .500 outfit.

Why would the Sox keep Abreu for another year or 2?, and trade his replacement? Sheets is not better than Vaughn at 1B. This team needs to get younger, not older.

And another thing I've noticed with how everyone is now coming out with all of these articles blasting the Sox for things we've all seen all year, but where were they to ask these questions or raise these issues when they had the chance all year? They've lobbed softball questions all year and just gobbled up the party line, then turn around with this crap at the end of the year when it didn't work out. It's so disingenuous and they don't deserve credit for raising the issues now when it's too late.

They may have had a line-up with power hitters but the tactics and strategy was to not hit for power, and that is where they screwed up. So you can blame the manager and coaches for not using tactics that best suit the players you have.

I'd try to get Yoan to use a leg kick and stride. Get his body moving in motion generate some pop. He rarely moves his feet.He can't keep doing what he's doing. He's so still until he swings and makes no effort to reach or adjust if he's fooled.

Grandal should be dfa'd five minutes after the final out of the season. He's fucking worthless.

SUCK IT AJ HATERS!!!!!!!! (I'm messing with you bro)

The new Soxtalk slogan?

If the Sox find a way to move Lucas and Moncada this off-season, I'd probably consider buying back in for season tickets. That's how much I'm sick of those 2 guys.

9/23/22 White Sox Division Math Cleveland 4-8 White Sox 12-0 Cleveland 3-9 White Sox 11-1 Cleveland 2-10 White Sox 10-2 Cleveland 1-11 White Sox 9-3 Cleveland 0-12 White Sox 8-4 9/23/22 White Sox Wild Card Math Seattle 6-7 White Sox 12-0 (Baltimore 9-4 or worse) Seattle 5-8 White Sox 11-1 (Baltimore 8-5 or worse) Seattle 4-9 White Sox 10-2 (Baltimore 7-6 or worse) Seattle 3-10 White Sox 9-3 (Baltimore 6-7 or worse) Seattle 2-11 White Sox 8-4 (Baltimore 5-8 or worse) Seattle 1-12 White Sox 7-5 (Baltimore 4-9 or worse) Seattle 0-13 White Sox 6-6 (Baltimore 3-10 or worse) 9/23/22 Games with Playoff Implications (Team(s) in Bold): American League Detroit (Rodriguez) @ Chicago (Giolito) Cleveland (Morris) @ Texas (Gray) Toronto (White) @ Tampa Bay (Springs) Houston (Urquidy) @ Baltimore (Kremer) Boston (Hill) @ New York A. L. (Cole) Seattle (Gonzales) @ Kansas City (Singer) Los Angeles A. L. (Ohtani) @ Minnesota (Varland) National League Milwaukee (Lauer) @ Cincinnati (Cessa) Atlanta (Odorizzi) @ Philadelphia (Nola) San Diego (Manaea) @ Colorado (Feltner) New York N. L. (Bassitt) @ Oakland (Irvin) San Francisco (Rodon) @ Arizona (Henry) Saint Louis (Quintana) @ Los Angeles N. L. (Heaney)

it's really the only plan in the thread with a strong likelihood of happening

Serious answer…if they could bring in a Tampa guy that knows what he’s doing, and Matt Quatraro is still a viable managerial candidate, why not?

I know Cashman will be somewhat of a popular name, and I can see the benefit of a guy who knows a lot of people and what to do...but it also sorta feels like a john fox hire. I have no idea whether he was constrained by the constant push to build via top free agents, or if he was buoyed by their constant ability to buy top free agents. I think a lot of their stuff is good but he had uber resources and built a lot of weird rosters. But when it seemed like he really took the reigns he had that incredible 2016 shift on the fly.

Sox record overall: 76-74: .507 (82-win pace) Sox record with Leury in the starting lineup: 34-42: .447 (72-win pace) Sox record without Leury in the starting lineup: 42-32: .568 (92-win pace) Obviously it's "too easy to look at results."

I'm fine with the articles, make sure it's repeated over and over, even if they were too chicken s%*# to call it out during the season and turn on fans. Shift or no shift makes no difference with WTP. They need to change their approach to hitting, because what they preached this year did not work.

There it is. People have been saying these things for quite a while and the silence from the press was deafening. Excuse me if I am not quite ready to celebrate these guys doing what they should have been doing for the past two years. Cowards.

Sox would tell him to stop sprinting to first when he walks in order to avoid being injured.

The talent severely regressed in many areas. What happened to Yoan’s speed, Timmy’s power, Vaughn’s eye, Robert’s defense, Giolito and Kopech’s velocity?

Agree, that's why we need a new owner, that we're never likely to get.

Yup. He absolutely will not be ready by opening day, even if he stays as a reliever.

Lack of player development.

For anyone who thought that Cairo was a magical solution I give you the last 3 games. Robert played 1 time and was still not physically able to play. The bullpen usage on Tuesday was straight up bizarre and almost certainly cost the game. The defense early in games was still comical. The offensive preparation was hilariously bad - how do you go into the biggest series of the year and take 1 walk in 3 games? And in general, Cleveland was far more motivated and prepared even though they were tired from a 5 games in 4 days series.

There is already some talk about giving Cairo the manager's job, and, if that happens, that is just another indication the Sox won't be fixed. The organization should do an extensive search for a new manager not just hand the job to a convenient man just because he's already connected to the team. There has to be some self-examination. But that would mean people would have to admit they have made mistakes, and I don't see that happening. Right now, this FO just doesn't have credibility. They are too busy blaming fans. The Rebuild is a failure.

The White Sox can be fixed next year, but they won't be fixed if the same people are doing the fixing.

Excellent point. It was also compounded by the fact that they focused on getting the lumber without worrying about whether they could find a spot for them all in the field. That's what happens when you try to reconstruct a team with a handful of deadline trades rather than commit to a coherent organizational development strategy.

This is actually a genius marketing move by the Sox. The "Swedish Satanic dressing as a Papal anti-Christ" market is completely untapped by MLB. Can't wait for Juggalo night next week once they dump the Coca Cola contract for Faygo. Seriously, even Veeck would have taken a hard pass on this.

Oh, here we go with the injury excuses. Give me a break.

Ive been a hater since June!?

Is anyone even enjoying or really getting satisfaction out of these articles? I guess it’s nice to see different media types on different platforms going in on the Sox, but it’s the same point over and over again, and the same point most of us have been saying forever. Nothing changes until new ownership arrives. Until then, we’ll be stuck in the same loop. I know that doesn’t give us much else to talk about, but it’s just the reality of the situation.

Its extremely unlikely that the White Sox can/will beat out the Guardians for the division for at least the next 5 years. The gap between the two orgs is growing larger every day.

There are so many things that impact an organization many that aren't seen. Just read a story in Sports Illustrated on the Mets and this caught my eye: "When the Mets returned from a 10 game West Coast road trip in June a gift was waiting for them: a pitching machine that can replicate any pitcher's exact delivery and repertoire. The device costs in the low six figures annually for a three year license. The team had already expanded the batting cage, offered bat fittings, began measuring players' grip strength and installed devices in the weight room to track players explosiveness and to identify when they need to rest." "The front office increased to 57 people in the spring from 32 in 2020 before the pandemic. It includes 20 analytical staffers." I bring this up simply because I've been told that when it comes to things like keeping players healthy, nutrition, sleep schedules et al the White Sox "play checkers while other teams play chess..."

Madrigal is better than Kwan, he just can’t stay healthy