Leaderboard

It matches the scam that's taking place on the field as well.

I really hope the “Hey Tony, pinch run Engel” guy at least gets an interview.

The Cubs are laughing at someone ELSE because of the Quintana deal? That is absolutely hysterical.

Rick Hahn vs. White Sox GMs and against his peers during his career (2013-2022). (Postseason = World Series, American League Pennants) White Sox All Time General Manager Records .568 Hank Greenberg ( 267-203-3 +64) (1959-1961) (1959 American League Pennant) .556 Charles Comiskey II (257-205-2 +52) (1956-1958) .535 Charles Comiskey (1115-968-48 +147) (1901-1914) (1906 World Series Championship & 1901 American League Pennant *) * = No 1901 World Series. .527 Ron Schuler (817-734-3 +83) (1991-2000) .521 Kenny Williams (1014-931-0 +83) (2001-2012) (2005 World Series Championship) .518 Frank Lane (559-519-9 +40) (1949-1955) .508 Stu Holcomb (243-235-0 +8) (1971-1973) .504 Ed Short (735-723-1 +12) (1962-1970) .491 Roland Hemond (922-957-6 -35) (1974-1985) .487 Harry Grabiner (2285-2408-27 -123) (1915-1945) (1917 World Series Championship & 1919 American League Pennant) .481 Larry Himes (311-335-0 -24) (1987-1990) .461 Rick Hahn (700-817-0 -117) (2013-2022) .444 Hawk Harrelson (72-90-0 -18) (1986) .425 Leslie O'Connor (195-265-4 -70) (1946-1948) Team Regular Season Records (2013-2022) ($xxx.xM = Average Payroll per Baseball Cube) (Postseason 2022 TBD) .613 Los Angeles N. L. (931-588) ($222.2M) (2020 World Series Championship; 2018 National League Pennant; 2017 National League Pennant) .565 New York A. L. (858-660) ($207.7M) .560 Saint Louis (848-666) ($144.4M) (2013 National League Pennant) .557 Cleveland (845-671) ($92.1M) (2016 American League Pennant) .548 Houston (832-686) ($124.3M) (2017 World Series Championship; 2021 American League Pennant; 2019 American League Pennant) .539 Boston (818-700) ($182.4M) (2018 World Series Championship; 2013 World Series Championship) .533 Tampa Bay (809-710) ($69.0M) (2020 American League Pennant) .523 Atlanta (793-723) ( $120.4M) (2021 World Series Championship) .520 Chicago N. L. (789-728) ($152.9M) (2016 World Series Championship) .513 Washington (778-740) ($152.8M) (2019 World Series Championship) .512 Milwaukee (778-741) ($95.2M) .509 Oakland (772-746) ($76.0M) .507 Toronto (770-748) ($134.2M) .506 Seattle (763-746) ($116.0M) .505 New York N. L. (767-751) ($148.4M) (2015 National League Pennant) .505 San Francisco (766-752) ($163.5M) (2014 World Series Championship) .490 Los Angeles A. L. (743-775) ($163.4M) .480 Minnesota (729-789) ($111.1M) .479 Pittsburgh (726-790) ($71.6M) .471 Texas (714-803) ($139.0M) .470 Kansas City (713-805) ($104.3M) (2015 World Series Championship; 2014 American League Pennant) .466 San Diego (707-811) ($113.7M) .464 Arizona (704-814) ($97.3M) .464 Philadelphia (704-814) ($145.0M) .461 Chicago A. L. (700-817) ($115.2M) .461 Colorado (700-818) ($115.8M) .453 Baltimore (687-831) ($99.4M) .452 Detroit (684-829) ($141.7M) .451 Cincinnati (684-834) ($112.4M) .431 Miami (653-863) ($71.4M)

Had a guy promised to park my car for free. Last time I saw it.

If these people are still going to the stadium, they deserve to be scammed, the seasons over!

As I put my kid to bed the other night, I looked at the Anderson and Moncada fatheads on his wall, the "Southside" flag he has hung up, and all the other Sox memorabilia he has collected and just got so angry. He's a fan because of me, just as I'm a fan because of my dad. We live in just about the heaviest Cubs neighborhood imaginable (even live across the street from a Cubs WS hero from 2016) and yet he and my other sons have remained die-hard Sox fans throughout their childhoods. They suffered through a rebuild that chewed up their formative years while their friends' team celebrated, I suspect largely out of loyalty to their dad. For years they have fended off their Cub fan friends by parroting what they heard from me: just wait 'til 2021/2022/2023, that's our time. Just wait. We went to 20 games in what should have been a season of joy, all the while I could tell they were looking at me wondering "so, when's this gonna happen? I told everybody this was going to happen, dad, so what's going on?" The answer, of course, was that it was not going to happen at all, and I'm not sure it ever will. Honestly, I feel guilty for believing in this franchise and worse for inflicting my kids with this Sox fan disease. Screw this team for making that happen. Screw them especially because they had legitimate success in their grasp and arrogantly pissed it away because of a dysfunctional front office beholden to a capricious, dictatorial owner. I know it's just sports. I have plenty of thoughts on what can be done to (hopefully) turn this around. But for now I'm just stewing in anger. That is all.

Just in continuing to build the case that Hahn is bad, I will keep drilling comparisons to the Atlanta Braves. For those new to my series, titled "Rick Hahn is bad", I've chosen the Braves because they to me are the most similar franchise to the White Sox. If that sounds odd, I'm referring to: - They are in same market group designations as the White Sox, so they do not get extra first round picks or international money (in fact, they've been crushed in international since the Coppy fiasco) - Have a strong but fickle fan base with a not great tv market that has put their budget in a lower stratosphere than the big market Dodgers/Giants/Red Sox/Cubs/Yankees/Mets/Phillies that are also teams who lack the additional team building boosts. For example, the estimated final payroll (I really can't find a site I like for this, but this comes from fangraphs roster resource) has the 2022 payroll of the Braves (post WORLD SERIES) at 188 million, less than the final 2022 payroll for the white sox of $196M. Both were also at similar payrolls. My thing with just firing Hahn for a new GM that, while likely being hand tied at how much can be done to revolutionize the MLB roster, could get a head start in trying to improve the organizations scouting and player development to be among the best in the game...which ANY franchise can achieve regardless of market size as the Tampa Rays and Guardians have shown. The Braves you may have noticed also had some underperforming stars this year. Albies and Acuna were injured for much of the year and not great in terms of production. Rosario's playoff magic did not translate at all, and Marcell Ozuna was awful in more ways than one. Matt Olson was good but not up to typical Matt Olson standards. Ian Anderson took a big step back, Odorizzi was a bad pickup, and Will Smith regressed in the bullpen. That is not the depths of struggles of the White Sox, as some guys had career years (Swanson and Riley). But the sox also had some of that of their own. Anyway this is a long way to get to the big difference between the franchises is while Hahn's minor leagues were completely tapped out by the time our team arrived in 2020, the Braves has not stopped. The modern braves arrived in 2018 when Acuna and Albies flew thru the ranks and added to longtime vets (Freeman) and smart trades (Inciarte and Swanson). Their starting pitching that year consisted of Julio Teheran, Folty, Sean Newcomb, Anibal Sanchez, and Brandon McCarthy. They still had one of the top farms in baseball. In 2019, they added from their farm Austin Riley, Mike Soroka and Max Fried join the rotation. In 2020, they added from their farm Ian Anderson, Touki Toussaint, and Kyle Wright. In 2021, they added from their farm William Contreras and Kyle Muller. In 2022, they added from their farm Michael Harris and Vaughn Grissom. Harris hits a 135 OPS+, Grissom a 118 OPS+ playing dynamic CF and 2b. They added Spencer Strider who was one of the best pitchers in baseball in the second half. They were able to replace Freddie Freeman with Matt Olson by trading out top prospect Christian Pache and Shea Langeliers. Look at their SP compared to 2018. Look at their bullpen. Look at their position players. You cannot have sustained excellence merely on the backs of your core being strong every year. You have to add and add and add and add and add and add. The pipeline can't stop. Michael Harris was a 3rd round pick in 2019, 20th overall. The Braves paid him 500k. 17 picks earlier the white sox took Andrew Dalquist and paid him 2 million. Did I mention he's a lefty? Vaughn Grissom is an 11th rounder from 2019. Shea Langeliers was picked 9th overall in 2019 which led to Olson. In 2020, they selected Spencer Strider in the 4th round for 500k. Because of the Jared Kelly bonus, the white sox selected a 10k signing who I don't know has played in baseball yet. They entered the year 22nd in org rankings for their farm. But that still allowed them to acquire Matt Olson, and introduce the possible NL rookie of year with either Strider or Harris. a 4th round pick and a 3rd. We will focus on the signings and ML budget. But it is all so much harder for the sox because they cannot sustainably bring talent in from draft and intl, and develop it.

Letting TLR manage this season with his heart and drinking problems and advanced age, was one of the biggest unforced errors in Sox history IMO.

I mean nobody calls it that so

In other words, no matter how you choose to evaluate the guy, he absolutely sucks and is one of the worst GMs in baseball history, yet here he still is...

Please, can we not hire an old manager again?

I do think I would be most interested in Beltran. But, I have a huge, wide group I'd be happy with. Would I be unhappy with Jirschele promotion? not really.

This media member is an absolute idiot if he believes that. The cubs got absolutely scorched in that deal even if Eloy decides he’s done with baseball and retires this offseason. There is no way they’re flaunting that deal and no way Hahn is furious about it.

With the Sox loss and Giants win today, the Sox end the season in the 15th pick position for the lottery. Smack dab in the middle, quite fitting for the team if you ask me. Simmed about 20-30 lotteries on Tankathon before winning.

The Engel dropped foul ball game in Baltimore.

Here’s a number for you: Just when you thought the season couldn’t get any worse, the Sox actually scored a negative amount of runs in their last inning of the year.

TLR was one really bad decision in a long string of really bad decisions that have led to this $190m fringe contender of a roster. As the owner, what he owes fans most is to hold his staff responsible for their failures and to stop treating the organization as some sort of dust bowl-era family farm business that you’re born into and can never be fired from. His baseball operations/player development/scouting corp, from top to bottom, is simply not a competitive group. It’s inexcusable that it hasn’t been overhauled/replaced at this point. It’s insane.

You give Vaughn 150+ games at 1b batting 3rd and a new clubhouse dynamic, you won’t be disappointed. But by all means, trade him and re-sign a 36 yr old, because he’s so loyal to our losing franchise.

1) Must have 100 PA/30 IP to receive a grade 2) Not holding time missed due to injuries against them A Dylan Cease A- Eloy Jimenez, Johnny Cueto, Reynaldo Lopez B+ Jose Abreu, Elvis Andrus, Michael Kopech B Andrew Vaughn, Tim Anderson, Jake Burger, Danny Mendick, Lance Lynn, Liam Hendriks B- Luis Robert, Seby Zavala, Kendall Graveman, Tanner Banks, Jimmy Lambert C+ Josh Harrison, Gavin Sheets C Lucas Giolito, Davis Martin C- AJ Pollock, Yoan Moncada, Romy Gonzalez, Vince Velasquez D+ Matt Foster D Jose Ruiz, Yasmani Grandal D- Adam Engel, Reese McGuire, Joe Kelly F(uck off) Leury Garcia, Dallas Keuchel

I have literally never heard that before.

TIFWIW (nothing probably) Everything in this thread is completely believable except the Ohtani offer. Guy blew it with that one. I tend to think it's bullshit just because of that one.

It is truly amazing for me to see some Sox fans continually s%*# on the '05 team over and over again. We got to see one of the best teams in the past 50+ years go wire to wire and win it all and people still say things like this. A team going wire to wire isn't luckboxing. But this post sums up why most of you that s%*# on that team don't deserve to see another team make it to the World Series cause you can't appreciate a goddamn thing. Absolutely baffling. If you view the '05 team that way, these past few years had to make your head absolutely explode.

I think those odds actually suggest that even the bookies haven't got a clue who it will be 8 names split by only 5 points in the betting.

I think we're smart enough to take both his career record and the circumstances into account. For example, he's made the playoffs twice, but he's been "Going for it" in 6 of those years, 4 different times he's thought he had a playoff team, added players, spent money, and traded away players to try to win now, and missed the playoffs. Even giving him a break on the rebuilding years, that's just absolutely awful. Most GMs get to do that once, maybe twice. This is where I get to saying that most teams in the league would have fired Hahn 4 times so far, with a good fraction firing him 5 times.

To me, the Naylor HR game. 2-for-1 special - deflated the s%*# out of us, and inflated the hell out of Cleveland.

I don't want extra requirements like "speaks Spanish" or "young" or "player friendly." I want the guy who will be the best at optimizing the talent he's provided through lineups, pitcher usage and instruction. Period. Any other qualities are nice to have, but those can be requirements of the bench coach if the manager doesn't have it.

Too bad Himes didn’t have Hahn’s leash. He acquired Thomas, Ventura, McDowell, Fernandez, Álvarez, Johnson, Bere. That team probably would have won the World Series in 1994 if it weren’t for the their owner sabotaging the season.

I am almost 50 now, and these have been going on my entire life. New Ballpark and old.

B....b...but Jerry isnt giving Hahn enough resources! hes a...... PRISONER!

0-11 with bases loaded, tallest midget award, goodbye Jose.

Engel's error against Baltimore with 2 out in the 9th, only to lose the game was the worst loss for me, mainly because it was so late in the season and led to another losing streak.

I'd rather just have Beltran as manager over the combo.

TIFWIW, but going from an old manager with heart problems to a slightly younger manager with heart problems seems problematic no?

35 year old putting up 4.2 WAR and stability that no one else would offer while being by far the best position player on the team this year is a pretty easy A.

This is far better.

You're giving Abreu an A for only have 15 homers?

Let's agree to disagree (I like aggressive baseball). I just hope a new Manager is allowed to hire his own coaches so we can finally part ways with Daryl Boston and Super Joe. They've both been around way to long (Joe 10 years? - Boston 7 years?) and have survived 3 managers which is most unusual in MLB.

My grades: A: Cease A-: Cueto B+: Andrus, Lopez B: Lynn, Lambert B-: Zavala, Hendriks, Abreu, Martin, Banks, Mendick C+: Eloy, Kopech, Vaughn, Cairo (as interim) C : TA, Graveman, Sheets, Romy C-: Robert, Harrison, Ruiz, Foster, Bummer, Velazquez, Burger D : Giolito, Moncada, Pollock F: Leury, Kuechel, Kelly, Diekman, Engel, Grandal, Sousa F-: LARUSSA

Those are some generous grades IMO

He is age 24. This is only his second season playing more than 55 professional games. He will continue to improve in terms of handling a full season, growing stronger as he approaches his likely peak age 26-28 seasons. He is still way ahead of most of his age 24 peers (21st overall in HR for age 24 players). His WAR takes a beating because he is not a competent outfielder, though that’s on the Sox, not him. Hahn cares more about what fans and others say about him than he does in performing his job, learning about his industry, and hiring quality competent people to fill in the gaps in his resume such as talent evaluation. Ted Phillps and the McCaskey family admit to having little to no football qualifications. Jerry and Rick act as though they have qualifications that they do not in fact possess outside of merely incompetently existing in their respective roles all these decades. Capable at business and negotiations? Yes, no doubt, top businesspeople IMO. Smart people, articulate? Yes, unquestioned. Competent baseball executives in terms of producing a quality and consistent on field product? No, also unquestioned, though I don’t believe that is their actual top priority. It’s merely a stated priority to sell tickets and maintain fan interest. If Hahn doesn’t want to be laughed at by his peers and fans, he could start by not acting like a four year old and stop throwing tv remote controls, and punching file cabinets, or being obsessed about others think about him. This is not how an executive should act or behave, it how a child acts and behaves. Become a competent baseball executive, the criticism will cease.

It's funny you brought this up. I spoke with a member of the mainstream media who has been covering Chicago's baseball teams for years. They told me Hahn is furious that the Cubs basically have been laughing at him for getting Eloy and supposedly they are privately telling other teams the same thing. The thinking is like you said, the Cubs knew his limitations and sold him off to whomever would take him. To me his issue is he has to lose weight and gain flexibility. Just look at videos of him from 2020, he's gotten huge muscle-wise.

Barely played 1B all season, yet alone the past couple of years cuz of Abreu and the manager. Gotta develop defensively too. He'll get better.

Hoping and praying and wishing. I actually just want you in there because we know the code....whenever you call someone pal they are about to be traded or fired.

I've got 73 games on video going back to 1981. I've got two dozen games on audio going back to 1959 and I've got 12 CD's with game highlights, interviews, Sox commercials et al going back to 1953. At least I've got something to take my mind off this terrible season.

So now can he fire Himself.

Guys Hahn is awesome. Remember he received executive of the year votes! Who needs to win in the playoffs if Rick received votes a year ago?!?

When does the parade start Rick?

That's bait

Why waste time on something that isn't going to happen? Jerry has never thought this way, nor will he start now.